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Coming from Kingdom Hearts, i cant help but notice some similarities with FFX



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yamibakura95

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The beggining of FFX, where everything freezes and you dont know whats going on, reminds me of KH2 when Roxas is in simulated twilight town and time freezes there too. Also, both dream zanarkand and virtual twilight town are artificial worlds.

Then you have Tidus who is a dream of the fayth. He reminds me of Roxas or Namine who are supposed to not be real people either.

Also, when a person dies in FFX, their body becomes pyreflies and in KH when someone loses their body, the body becomes similar looking light particles.

Dream Zanakard reminds me of virual twilight town or the realm of sleep in DDD.

Now, i know FFX came first but i played KH waay before i touched FF series so in my mind KH comes first.
 
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Dream Zanarkand might be a Chrono Cross reference- there's stuff about parallel universes and "dream" worlds in that game.
Also, FFX is FFIV/Secret of Mana on steroids, imo.
 

Guernsey

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I never thought of FFIV or Mana when I was playing FFX to be honest. Kingdom Hearts does crib a lot of ideas from the Final Fantasy games especially FFX and FFVII.
 
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I never thought of FFIV or Mana when I was playing FFX to be honest. Kingdom Hearts does crib a lot of ideas from the Final Fantasy games especially FFX and FFVII.
I didn't notice it really until I started playing FFIV and SOM later. There's actually enough references in FFX from FFIV and from certain games in Squaresoft's collection of games.
Here's a short list:

Tidus from a Dream World= character from dream world in Chrono Cross I think?
Tidus being upbeat=Zidane personality, who is upbeat
Seymour (actually Shimoa) is a reference to the number 4 (Shi, plus Seymour has four fights), but that number is associated with death. Likely a reference to the fact that Seymour dies in the game and remains as an unsent. Also, I noticed that Thanatos (who seems to function as one of the heavenly generals or fiends) is in Seymour's role.
Sin=Mana Beast/Giant of Babil?
Mana Beast is said to be able to destroy the world. Giant of Babil is specifically tailored towards doing that even more than the Mana Beast, who is trying to restore the balance of Mana.
 

Guernsey

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Speaking of references, what do you think of the "spirit body" concept that Kingdom Hearts cribbed from FFX? I think it must have some basis in mythology and religion.
 

Rodin

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When I first started FFx I had the same thoughts about the opening.

The Norts are just the Sephiroth/Genesis copies from FF7.

Kadaj and his brothers are a darker version of Roxas.

Same with Lumina from FF13-3.

Jack/King/Queen from Type 0 reminds me of Terra/Ven/Aqua.

The Deepground are a less complex version of Organization 13.
 
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Speaking of references, what do you think of the "spirit body" concept that Kingdom Hearts cribbed from FFX? I think it must have some basis in mythology and religion.
That's actually FFVII:
{Aeris}
“Those are the spirit bodies of the Ancients.”
“They've been away from
their Planet for a long time
to protect this Temple.”

Now, if you mean how the concept works- well.
Koichi Ishii is behind it, I think.

The lifestream concept was developed from Sakaguchi, but I found out in an interview that Ishii claims that Sakaguchi adapted/altered the concept from him.
Koichi Ishii was on the original FF team, it appears.
Mana is a concept in Secret of Mana that's supposed to be (according to the traditional religion of Southeast Asians/Indonesians) a spiritual/mental energy. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mana

It also fits in (a coincidence?) with the Balinese Gamelan music that Hiroki Kikuta utilizes to personify Thanatos in the game, as well as the "Indonesian temple" aesthetic at some parts of the game.

The shmuplations link won't enable me to post the actual developer interview from 1993. Just look up Shmuplations (.com) and /secretofmana together.
 
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I know this is late. This is very interesting so Mana has been dealing with this theme before Final Fantasy?
Apparently, the answer is yes, if we mean before FFVII. Which I find to be very interesting. Koichi Ishii also mentioned in the interview that Mana was based on his idea of the crystals in the early FFs at the time.
 

Guernsey

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It seems as tough that Square has been dealing with these themes since forever. It also explains the crystals in the Final Fantasy games but I wonder if there is any real world mythology behind the concepts?
 

Elysium

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The use of FF tropes was deliberate, so naturally there will be similarities. A thought just occurred to me of some that can be found to FFIX--compare Brahne and Kuja to Maleficent and AnsemSOD. Maleficent, like Brahne, simply a puppet of the larger villain to basically collect MacGuffins (the eidolons in IX, the princesses in KH) and wipe out a massive portion of the world / worlds, before being removed from the stage for the real villain. Both Maleficent and Brahne have a huge body count--of course, KH walks back the damage because everyone is resurrected at the end.

Of course, they could've been even more similar, what with Necron coming up after Kuja suddenly in the last moments of the game. Chernabog could've played that role as a literal embodiment of darkness since he's there in End of the World anyway.
 
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The use of FF tropes was deliberate, so naturally there will be similarities. A thought just occurred to me of some that can be found to FFIX--compare Brahne and Kuja to Maleficent and AnsemSOD. Maleficent, like Brahne, simply a puppet of the larger villain to basically collect MacGuffins (the eidolons in IX, the princesses in KH) and wipe out a massive portion of the world / worlds, before being removed from the stage for the real villain. Both Maleficent and Brahne have a huge body count--of course, KH walks back the damage because everyone is resurrected at the end.

Of course, they could've been even more similar, what with Necron coming up after Kuja suddenly in the last moments of the game. Chernabog could've played that role as a literal embodiment of darkness since he's there in End of the World anyway.
That's a good point, although I'm not sure if Ansem replaced Chernabog as the big bad at the end or not at some point in development. I need to do more research some time, but I thought I remember reading (gamefaqs member testimony) that Ansem was created late into KH's development. If that's the case, then Ansem was terrifically created for the brief time period. If not, then he's still an interesting character- reminds me of Thanatos from Secret of Mana (or my brain's still on Secret of Mana juice, but I still think there's some influence on the rest of 90s/2000s KH/FF series from Secret of Mana) but fleshed out to a reasonable degree (with Necron/Eternal Darkness/Cloud of Darkness) mixed in. He's one of the most perfect villains I've seen in any media in KHI.
 

Rodin

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One of my friends joked that Noel was an older/mature version of Sora and I kinda see it now.

Noel, Hope and Serah give off SRK vibes together.
 
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One of my friends joked that Noel was an older/mature version of Sora and I kinda see it now.

Noel, Hope and Serah give off SRK vibes together.
Sora's design is technically from Sion from The Bouncer. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bouncer_(video_game). If anything, Sora's an alternative take/a regression of Sion's design. Maybe it comes full circle if Noel (more mature) was based on Sora (less mature)?
 

Rodin

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Lol sure but I was thinking similarities between personality than design.

Granted I think Tidus and Zack have more in common with Sora personality wise.
I can see Sora coming from Zidane/Tidus. Zack on the other hand (besides Nojima writing him on his own, meaning Zack's likely his own character, unless Nojima was influenced by FFVI)... personally I think a large part of Zack (from his scenes to Midgar) comes from Baram (Billy) from FFVI- Nomura helped write the Shadow/Clyde and Baram (Billy) backstory in FFVI, and Baram seems to possess Zack's sort of optimistic- "oh yeah, we're rich!" when stealing from/stopping a train in one of the flashback scenes. So whether Baram's personality got to Sora or not is another question. I think it's more unlikely that Baram influenced Sora rather than Zidane/Tidus, imo.

Zack from Crisis Core gave almost a 1-1 ratio of Sora's mannerisms from KHII at certain points, meaning KHII probably influenced Crisis Core and its depiction of characters, animations, imo. Personally I think that Zack's also like some sort of puppy in that game, than some sort of happy-go-lucky "I'll do any hard or dangerous work for the reward".
 

Rodin

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I can see Sora coming from Zidane/Tidus. Zack on the other hand (besides Nojima writing him on his own, meaning Zack's likely his own character, unless Nojima was influenced by FFVI)... personally I think a large part of Zack (from his scenes to Midgar) comes from Baram (Billy) from FFVI- Nomura helped write the Shadow/Clyde and Baram (Billy) backstory in FFVI, and Baram seems to possess Zack's sort of optimistic- "oh yeah, we're rich!" when stealing from/stopping a train in one of the flashback scenes. So whether Baram's personality got to Sora or not is another question. I think it's more unlikely that Baram influenced Sora rather than Zidane/Tidus, imo.

Zack from Crisis Core gave almost a 1-1 ratio of Sora's mannerisms from KHII at certain points, meaning KHII probably influenced Crisis Core and its depiction of characters, animations, imo. Personally I think that Zack's also like some sort of puppy in that game, than some sort of happy-go-lucky "I'll do any hard or dangerous work for the reward".
My FF knowledge is limited to more recent games. So I'd take your word for it.

I disagree about Sora and Zack. I never found Sora to be a hard worker and Zack's story was him dealing with Shinra's sins. He already gained what he wanted at the start.
 
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