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Confusion about Roxas



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Relix

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Namine is special because she is a nobody that exists without a body and soul. She was brought into the world by Sora having released Kairi's heart from his body but Roxas was the one that got ownership over Sora's body and soul and yet Namine still exists. DiZ and others have tried to explain her existence but the farthest they have gotten is: "Special Nobody" and "Fleeting Shadow" or something like that she is nothing but a shadow of Kairi. To be honest, Namine is the most "nobody" out of all nobodies. She shouldn't exist. Yet she does.
 

Auxia

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Sorry dude I know what I'm talking about. Anyway what everyone said. Sora is a walking heart which gives him another similarity to Xehanort because Xehanrot's Heartless was technically a floating heart as well. (In his brown cloaked persona I believe)

Everyone says Sora was just a floating heart, but where's the source? Is it in Jiminy's Journal from KH2 (I don't have KH2 anymore, traded it for KH1)? That would clear up a lot of confusion, at least for me.

Also, if that much is true, and Roxas was Sora's body and soul, why could only Sora see Roxas during their encounter at The World That Never Was? If Roxas had a body and soul, Donald and Goofy should have been able to see him. In fact, Sora should have been the one who went unseen - thought that's impossible because he's the protagonist.
On a related note, if Roxas is indeed Sora's body and soul with Ven's heart, he isn't a Nobody - regardless of how he came into "existence". There are specific criteria as outlined by Ansem the Wise that define Nobodies, the most prominent of which being they DON'T possess hearts. This goes as far as to say that Xion wasn't a Nobody either, "special" or otherwise. She was just a puppet with a heart. Namine, on the other hand, is a "special" Nobody due to her lack of heart and the circumstances surrounding her coming into being, circumstances which I myself am not totally clear about.
 

Relix

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Everyone says Sora was just a floating heart, but where's the source? Is it in Jiminy's Journal from KH2 (I don't have KH2 anymore, traded it for KH1)? That would clear up a lot of confusion, at least for me.

Also, if that much is true, and Roxas was Sora's body and soul, why could only Sora see Roxas during their encounter at The World That Never Was? If Roxas had a body and soul, Donald and Goofy should have been able to see him. In fact, Sora should have been the one who went unseen - thought that's impossible because he's the protagonist.
On a related note, if Roxas is indeed Sora's body and soul with Ven's heart, he isn't a Nobody - regardless of how he came into "existence". There are specific criteria as outlined by Ansem the Wise that define Nobodies, the most prominent of which being they DON'T possess hearts. This goes as far as to say that Xion wasn't a Nobody either, "special" or otherwise. She was just a puppet with a heart. Namine, on the other hand, is a "special" Nobody due to her lack of heart and the circumstances surrounding her coming into being, circumstances which I myself am not totally clear about.

Firstly, No matter how you say it, the reason why Roxas exists is because Sora's heart left his body and his body and soul acted on their own. This being is called a nobody. Just because he has something other nobodies doesn't have doesn't make him an entire different species all together.

Secondly, Sora's heart left his body and his body and soul went to Twilight Town and formed his nobody. This nobody was given the name Roxas. Ansem the Wise wrote what standard nobodies were and how normal nobodies are made, but he is stumped by Roxas and Namine. In the end of KH2 he's realized that there are things he has yet to understand about everything he thought as fact. Roxas was created the same way a nobody is but he is different in the fact that even though Sora's heart left his body and soul, he somehow has emotions and feelings and is hinted to have Ven's fractured heart. He isn't the same as the rest just as Namine is but he is still a nobody all the same.

Thirdly, Xion didn't come into existence as a nobody would. you are missing the point. Yes not having a heart is a sign of a nobody but they come into existence through a specific and perculiar method that Yen Sid, DiZ, and others have pointed out. If a strong heart leaves the body, and the body and soul animate and come to life on their own, they are a nobody. The shell of the person they once were. Xion was created as you even said yourself, as a puppet. Created in a lab, experimented on, and given a specific task to do. Riku Replica is not a nobody he is a replica. Xion is not a nobody she is a replica. She was not created by someone heart leaving a body. No heartless was made to accompany with a nobody. She can't be a special anything she doesn't classify under.

Fourthly, If Roxas, Sora's nobody, therefore having Sora's body and soul that means Sora has all that is left of the heart, soul, and body combo. Which is the heart. Kairi restored Sora's heart to him when he was a heartless when she hugged him. Giving him his form back but not his body and soul seeing how uhm Roxas is still in existence and using it.

And lastly, Roxas and Sora's fight was internal. Sora got his body and soul back when Roxas went back to Sora in the beginning to KH2. what is left of Roxas was triggered by Axel's death and challenged Sora to an internal struggle. Evidence? they fought in the station of Awakening which is located within the heart. Roxas was still doing this while inside Sora. He cried when he left Twilight Town. He held the blue orb thing through Sora with the others, he's still there but not in the physical plane. It was an internal struggle. Anything else you want me to point out?
 

Goldpanner

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Also, if that much is true, and Roxas was Sora's body and soul, why could only Sora see Roxas during their encounter at The World That Never Was?

...You know that scene where the pod opens and Roxas goes 'looks like my summer holidays are... over...'? That was when his body and soul were put back in 'Sora' entity again.

Yet Roxas had his own will by that point, which was the ghost-like thing that popped out way later at TWTNW.
 

Lelouch

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Roxas is essentially both Sora's and Ven's nobody. He had Sora's body and soul with Ven's heart inside him. That is why he can feel emotion and can wield a keyblade. Roxas is a special nobody for that reason.
 
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Roxas is still a nobody. Roxas is Sora's nobody, he has Sora's body and soul, and he has Ven's heart. Obviously having Ven's heart influenced him to look like him. Yes nobody's don't have hearts; they don't have their OWN hearts. Like I just said, Roxas is Sora's body and soul, with VEN's heart. Roxas can still be considered a nobody because he doesn't have his own heart, he has Ven's, it's like an emblemed heartless, they have hearts inside of them, but they really don't belong to them, that's why they are still considered heartless.
 

Igloo9

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No, Roxas isn't a nobody. I don't know why everyone thinks he is. Just because he was born the same way nobodies are born doesn't automatically make him a nobody. It's simple logic, look:

A nobody is a being without a heart.
Roxas has a heart.
Therefore, Roxas is not a nobody because he has a heart.
 

Allister Rose

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No, Roxas isn't a nobody. I don't know why everyone thinks he is. Just because he was born the same way nobodies are born doesn't automatically make him a nobody. It's simple logic, look:

A nobody is a being without a heart.
Roxas has a heart.
Therefore, Roxas is not a nobody because he has a heart.
but roxas didn't feel anything inside him. I'm sure if he does have have a heart inside him, it wasn't connected to him. he was able to dual wield because xion awoken another keyblade inside sora which roxas was able to use.

it sort of hints that he doesnt, and nomura didn't answer it directly even though he did hint it, he made it so we wouldn't know the answer. he's technically a nobody though even if he did have a heart inside him.

just pretend nobodies are portable video games without batteries (heart), and roxas just hapens to be a portable video game with dead batteries
 

Relix

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No, Roxas isn't a nobody. I don't know why everyone thinks he is. Just because he was born the same way nobodies are born doesn't automatically make him a nobody. It's simple logic, look:

A nobody is a being without a heart.
Roxas has a heart.
Therefore, Roxas is not a nobody because he has a heart.

I like how you showed up and totally disregarded others posts that shot down this. roxas=special nobody but a nobody none the less. born like other nobodies, uses the body and soul of his former self, but has a hint of a heart, the only thing making him different from the others, thus making him special. what are you gonna call him? his own person? he is using Sora's body and Sora's soul to even exist, having or even being linked to Ven's heart is a bonus, if he isn't a nobody then what is he? he's using his former self's body and soul, sounds like a nobody to me, he just has, how Allister puts it dead batteries(heart), doesn't change what or who he is.
 

Allister Rose

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I like how you showed up and totally disregarded others posts that shot down this. roxas=special nobody but a nobody none the less. born like other nobodies, uses the body and soul of his former self, but has a hint of a heart, the only thing making him different from the others, thus making him special. what are you gonna call him? his own person? he is using Sora's body and Sora's soul to even exist, having or even being linked to Ven's heart is a bonus, if he isn't a nobody then what is he? he's using his former self's body and soul, sounds like a nobody to me, he just has, how Allister puts it dead batteries(heart), doesn't change what or who he is.
i didn't think mean to disregard. i thought the answer was sort of clear so i just gave my two cents (in which maybe i was repeating someone) but it's good to know we agree
 

Igloo9

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I like how you showed up and totally disregarded others posts that shot down this. roxas=special nobody but a nobody none the less. born like other nobodies, uses the body and soul of his former self, but has a hint of a heart, the only thing making him different from the others, thus making him special. what are you gonna call him? his own person? he is using Sora's body and Sora's soul to even exist, having or even being linked to Ven's heart is a bonus, if he isn't a nobody then what is he? he's using his former self's body and soul, sounds like a nobody to me, he just has, how Allister puts it dead batteries(heart), doesn't change what or who he is.

The reason I did that is because I've tried saying it several times in the past, but people give stupid replies like "Oh...uh, well I guess Roxas is just a SPECIAL nobody then." I mean really? That's the only excuse? How many special nobodies are there now, then? Everyone else seems to be special, too.

And yes, Roxas was BORN like a nobody, but that doesn't make him one. He was born the same way but still isn't one.

When someone becomes a heartless, the empty shell, you know, the thing that "doesn't have a heart" becomes a nobody. And since Roxas has Ven's heart, that doesn't make him a nobody. And sure, it may not be 100% confirmed that Ven's heart is inside Roxas, but Nomura basically said it did in the Ultimania.
 

Swordsaint

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Having a heart is different to having your own heart. Much like a heartless steal other peoples heart, but emblem heartless still have hearts, just not their own.
is simple as. l2comprehend.

he was born from sora, and had all the same traits as a nobody. his connection to vens heart gave him emotion, but as stated by definition, nobodies lack their own hearts.
 

Igloo9

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Having a heart is different to having your own heart. Much like a heartless steal other peoples heart, but emblem heartless still have hearts, just not their own.
is simple as. l2comprehend.

You have a point. But still, if a nobody is a being without a heart, they shouldn't be called nobodies. They should have invented a new being then: A nobody that has someone else's heart instead of their own, lol.

I'm kidding obviously, but it can't be that stupid of an idea after everything else that Nomura made happen in the KH series. ;D

Nice avi btw.
 

Swordsaint

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You have a point. But still, if a nobody is a being without a heart, they shouldn't be called nobodies. They should have invented a new being then: A nobody that has someone else's heart instead of their own, lol.

I'm kidding obviously, but it can't be that stupid of an idea after everything else that Nomura made happen in the KH series. ;D

Nice avi btw.
fairy tail fan? it's been growing in popularity!

i think that being born without ones own heart is classification enough to be a nobody. saying that harbouring someone elses heart makes him not a nobody is like saying because sora also carried ven's heart he's something more than a somebody.

i think the process of being born the same as a nobody, and lacking ones own heart is enough.
 

Igloo9

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Fairy Tail fan indeed!

And...I guess it makes sense. Roxas just doesn't seem like much of a nobody. :/ Having emotions, having Ven's heart, and him crying in Days, but I guess you have a point. But the thing is, a nobody is a "being/shell with no heart", not a "being/shell without their 'own' heart." So it shouldn't really matter, as long as he has a heart.
 

Swordsaint

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Fairy Tail fan indeed!

And...I guess it makes sense. Roxas just doesn't seem like much of a nobody. :/ Having emotions, having Ven's heart, and him crying in Days, but I guess you have a point. But the thing is, a nobody is a "being/shell with no heart", not a "being/shell without their 'own' heart." So it shouldn't really matter, as long as he has a heart.

That's why he's referred to as a special nobody. Everyone in-game thinks he's a nobody. (well that we know about) but he's referred to as special because he exhibits behaviour a nobody shouldn't despite being brought in to this world as a nobody.

you could say he retconned the idea of "having no heart" and instead said "well they assumed they must not have a heart because they didn't know of ven's being within Roxas"

retcons aren't always bad, they allow us to more surprised and can add more depth to the story. being able to guess everything isn't fun at all.

i understand your perception of this though. and maybe it's incorrect to truly call him a nobody. you could probably say he's a halfbody or someoneelsebody (lol) but the only reason he truly felt anything was because he used someone elses heart to emote, and not that he used his own. Roxas only appears like ven because he carried ven, it influenced that, if vens heart wasnt there he would be a nobody who looked like sora more than ven.

so personally i'd still say he's a nobody, and i don't really find the fact he gets called a 'special' nobody irritating, because there are reasons they call him special.

this is pretty much how i see it, I mean look at Axel. He exhibits true emotion as well. Why? because he used Sora's/Ven's heart as a medium.
 

Allister Rose

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That's why he's referred to as a special nobody. Everyone in-game thinks he's a nobody. (well that we know about) but he's referred to as special because he exhibits behaviour a nobody shouldn't despite being brought in to this world as a nobody.

you could say he retconned the idea of "having no heart" and instead said "well they assumed they must not have a heart because they didn't know of ven's being within Roxas"

retcons aren't always bad, they allow us to more surprised and can add more depth to the story. being able to guess everything isn't fun at all.

i understand your perception of this though. and maybe it's incorrect to truly call him a nobody. you could probably say he's a halfbody or someoneelsebody (lol) but the only reason he truly felt anything was because he used someone elses heart to emote, and not that he used his own. Roxas only appears like ven because he carried ven, it influenced that, if vens heart wasnt there he would be a nobody who looked like sora more than ven.

so personally i'd still say he's a nobody, and i don't really find the fact he gets called a 'special' nobody irritating, because there are reasons they call him special.

this is pretty much how i see it, I mean look at Axel. He exhibits true emotion as well. Why? because he used Sora's/Ven's heart as a medium.
well, we don't even know. for one, ven's heart isn't complete and is in a state of sleep.

the way 358/2 days ultimania hints is, that it's stil in sora
 

Swordsaint

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well, we don't even know. for one, ven's heart isn't complete and is in a state of sleep.

the way 358/2 days ultimania hints is, that it's stil in sora
that only go further to prove roxas is a nobody.
why does roxas feel emotion then? purely from his connection to sora?
 

Weeaboo

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Most likely.

That and he he MIGHT have held Ven's heart. I don't know....He might not have.

Or, Ven's heart is in Ven and a small glimmer went to Sora so as Ven wouldn't get hurt.
 
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