Heartless Issue in Castle Oblivion

[PhantomSora14]

Part I:

After reading another thread, I think everyone generally agreed that the heartless from floors 1-12 were imaginary or a figment of sora's memory. This completely makes sense because if sora would die (aka I failed at defeating a group of heartless), we are taken to the screen where it says "Continue or Return to Main Title". However, unlike like KH, sora's heart is not floating above him. So I guess his heart has not been lost.

Part II:

Now even thought the heartless were just memories, something confused me with the story plot. After playing through Wonderland and Halloween town, I realized something. Sora's heartless memories are not concerned about the heart, they are concerned about memories. For example, the heartless stole the queen of heart's memories in Wonderland. Heartless dont do that. Another thing, the heartless were activated when the professor sniffed the memory potion in Halloweentown.

Now even though these heartless are memories, they have taken some kind of life, almost like another being. Instead of hearts, they are stealing memories within Sora. Which leads me to think, these are not heartless sora is battling in COM, they are something completely different. I mean think about it, the rooms in castle oblivion simply changed decor to sora's memories. The people that appeared in these memories aka Leon, Winnie the Pooh, etc. were simply a projection of the connection sora had with those people. The "heartless" are different. They have no direct connection to sora, other than darkness. But that means everytime sora would see the heartless, memories of darkness would be engraved in his memories, which wouldn't that eventually overpower him and he become controlled by the darkness?

This is not so much of a theory as a speculation. I just want some input, see if this makes sense or not.

 

[Angel]

Hearts hold memories. So I guess they smelled the memories and thought, "Mmm, a heart! DINNER TIMEZ!"

And even though all the characters were made of Sora's memories, they seemed to be quite beyond that.

Especially Memory-Aerith and Memory-Maleficient, who seemed aware of their status as mere memories, which is something not even Sora had picked up on.

 

[jda-roxas]

i believe that that theory has some truth to it but isn't it Namine screwing with soras memories?
also i agree that hearts do hold memories so that is why they are after sora in pairison with him remembering that the heartless were after him cause of the keyblade.

 

[Lifes.Lover]

Well, just like in the way that Naminé tinkered with Aerith and the other characters in order to warn Sora of the impending danger, this too might have been a way for her to do it.

Instead of the Heartless seeking out hearts, they were seeking out memories. This might have been her way of warning him 'hold on, something's not right, why are the memories important to the Heartless?'.

Also, I agree with bamak93

 

[Smile]

I actually don't think that's the case. I mean, it is possible to die in CoM, and if Sora was to die against things he has battled before, what use did he have to the Organization? None.
Plus, throwing Sora in against real Heartless in CoM would be beneficial to the Organization's goals of building Kingdom Hearts, seeing how he's slaying them with the Keyblade.

It was never truly stated that the Heartless were what stole the Queen of Hearts' Memories; that was actually pure speculation on Sora's side since the Heartless are, to him, to blame for everything.
That hardly means that the QoH saying she lost her Memories really means she did - that was Namine toying around and presenting a plot for Sora to try and read into, which he didn't.
The Heartless were, in a way, a "plot device" in it, but that's hardly to say they really did what Sora blamed them for. In KH1, the accused the Heartless for stealing the Queen's Heart. Why then not do the same in CoM, and instead take the blame himself, if the Heartless really "did" it?
Because they didn't. It was just a too easy to reach assumption for him - regardless of how true it was.

However, unlike like KH, sora's heart is not floating above him. So I guess his heart has not been lost.

Maybe because Sora is only a Heart in CoM? If his Heart was floating above his "Body", his "Body" would fade since it's in fact his Sense of Self and not really his Body. So Sora having no Heart floating above him doesn't mean his Heart wasn't lost - it's just that he had no Body for the Heart to float out of.

Now even thought the heartless were just memories, something confused me with the story plot. After playing through Wonderland and Halloween town, I realized something. Sora's heartless memories are not concerned about the heart, they are concerned about memories. For example, the heartless stole the queen of heart's memories in Wonderland. Heartless dont do that. Another thing, the heartless were activated when the professor sniffed the memory potion in Halloweentown.

I like to think those were times in which Namine tried to warn Sora about how dangerous discovering his "true Memories" is.
How unfortunate he never really gave a damn.

 

[PhantomSora14]

So your saying Namine was somewhat controlling the heartless to throw out hints about memories?

btw it does make sense that heartless are somewhat attracted to memories because of the heart, however, i forget what the relationship between a nobody and a memory is...do the nobody's actually carry memories?

 

[Smile]

So your saying Namine was somewhat controlling the heartless to throw out hints about memories?

Yes and no.
Yes, because the characters were talking about the Heartless stealing Memories instead of Hearts.
No because the Heartless were just there. They didn't really "show up" when the Dr. smelled his potion, nor did they really steal the Queen's Memories. Those're just variations of the original story Namine made the people in the Memory Floors say. The Heartless were there because you need to fight things in a KH game.

btw it does make sense that heartless are somewhat attracted to memories because of the heart, however, i forget what the relationship between a nobody and a memory is...do the nobody's actually carry memories?

That was never properly explained, though we hope to go in depth about it in Days. Xion at least raises the highly possibility that Memories do physically move away from the Heart in a sense.

 

[AquaX]

heartless cant hold memories

 

[Angel]

heartless cant hold memories

go back and fucking replay CoM, please.

 

[Smile]

Heartless are the Heart. Therefore, they very much can hold the Memories. What seems to take place is that the Darkness cuts the Heart's ties to the Memories, as seen with Sora - when he became a Heartless, he began forgetting things, until Kairi purified him - thus pushing the Darkness away and letting his Memories return.
XH is the same - he cast off his Body, but was never overtaken by the Darkness. His Sense of Self held it at bay enough for him to remember himself.

 

[MasterHearts7762]

I think you could be onto something. Everything-including the heartless-in CO were just apart of his memory. So it could be possible that those specific heartless have no desire to caprture hearts, because theyre not even actual heartless.

 

[PhantomSora14]

I like wat ur saying SufferingAngel, because that leads me to think that those cut off memories may go somewhere besides a nobody, i mean memories just dont float there and look pretty, maybe the unbirths have something to do w/ this (super super flame shield) lol.

i definetely think there is more to memories than meets the eyes

 

[Smile]

I personally like to think that Unbirths are related to Memories too. Certainly would tie in nicely with my Namine = Unbirth theory XD;;;
Fact remains though that Memories are playing as big a role as the Hearts themselves do, if not a bigger one yet. We've hardly seen everything they can do, if the latest Days trailer is any indication at all.

 

[PhantomSora14]

LOL nice SufferingAngel, i think unbirths have to do w/ memories too. it makes sense considering nomura said that unbirths were like the pre-heartless, and since the heart holds memories, it makes sense. if an unbirth would just hold and steal memories, i think that is pretty simple. if ones memories are stolen they can be replaced, but that would be difficult. Actually, i guess if we went along with the idea that unbirths=darkness+memories, then that means Xehanort would have an unbirth, which would probably set up KH3 .

So u think Namine is an unbirth, if in fact, unbirths are related to memories? Post ur thread where u theorized about it, i would like to examine it .