• Hello everybody! We have tons of new awards for the new year that can be requested through our Awards System thanks to Antifa Lockhart! Some are limited-time awards so go claim them before they are gone forever...

    CLICK HERE FOR AWARDS

HOW DOES XEANORT DIE!!!???????!!!



REGISTER TO REMOVE ADS
Status
Not open for further replies.

Dowhax

Bronze Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2009
Messages
1,139
Age
34
@Dowhax:

You still don't get it?



is wrong!!!
Losing or giving up your heart in the universe of Kingdom Hearts is not dying, we have as of now no character seen who really died.

Implied by the Secret Ansem Report 4, "true" death as we know it only then occurs when the soul leaves the body.

I never said dying was when a person in Kingdom Hearts fully kill themselves to where they never come back, It's meant to be in a way where they (for right now) end up in someone else/as someone else (like a nobody/heartless). This is also why I put 'died' to make dying become metaphorical (is the word I'm trying to think of) in a sense.
 

Oracle Spockanort

written in the stars
Staff member
Joined
Jul 13, 2008
Messages
35,654
Awards
96
Age
33
Location
California
Website
twitter.com
Really, Nomura need to name it something because everybody keeps calling it death/dying in the metaphorical sense (which of course metaphorically is an accurate term but since that is not death, but a transformation into two beings, we need a better word for it.)
 

Sephiroth0812

Guardian of Light
Joined
Oct 22, 2010
Messages
10,531
Awards
37
Location
Germany
Really, Nomura need to name it something because everybody keeps calling it death/dying in the metaphorical sense (which of course metaphorically is an accurate term but since that is not death, but a transformation into two beings, we need a better word for it.)

Hmm...how about an "Existence Transition"?
In normal cases (disregarding Sora, Kairi and Xehanort here), the nobody practically "carries on" while the original existence goes "on hold/into suspended animation" until the heart is freed by killing the heartless and the body/soul becomes free again by kicking the nobody into darkness.

In the more common cases when just a heartless is created (Nomura even said that the creation of a non-human nobody is a rare occurence) it could be even called an "Existence stop!" because the body/soul become inactive and don't age. Once the heartless is slain, the heart is freed and returns to its body/soul and the original being is recreated as it was before the heartless was made.
 

Dowhax

Bronze Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2009
Messages
1,139
Age
34
Hmm...how about an "Existence Transition"?
In normal cases (disregarding Sora, Kairi and Xehanort here), the nobody practically "carries on" while the original existence goes "on hold/into suspended animation" until the heart is freed by killing the heartless and the body/soul becomes free again by kicking the nobody into darkness.

In the more common cases when just a heartless is created (Nomura even said that the creation of a non-human nobody is a rare occurence) it could be even called an "Existence stop!" because the body/soul become inactive and don't age. Once the heartless is slain, the heart is freed and returns to its body/soul and the original being is recreated as it was before the heartless was made.


Ya, so where would Ven fall under? Existence Transition?
 

Sephiroth0812

Guardian of Light
Joined
Oct 22, 2010
Messages
10,531
Awards
37
Location
Germany
The second of those, however Ven is a different case because he didn't "lose" his heart the normal way. Ven's existence "stopped", or rather fell comatose because his heart was critically injured, not lost to the darkness.
If one pays close attention in the scenes of Aqua's ending and the beginning of Final Episode one can even see that Ven still has his heart all the way up until Aqua leaves him in the chamber of waking, as he can still summon his keyblade to open a door to Land of Departure.
The reason Ven went comatose is not because of his heart physically leaving the body, but because it was so heavily injured and weakened it couldn't maintain an awake state anymore.
So Ven's heart is "lost", but not in the sense of losing a heart to create a heartless.
When Aqua left Ven alone in his chamber, his heart couldn't struggle against the wound any longer and started to fade (this is not the same as creating a heartless, losing your heart doesn't always mean the creation of a heartless. Riku's heart got kicked out of his body in KH 1 too and it also became no heartless!).
The extreme pain and sadness Ven felt at that time reached Sora through their already established connection, and his voice guided Ven's heart to Sora's, where Ven's plea to stay with him was accepted by Sora.
So Ven's heart went to "rest", so in essence Ven is really "sleeping".

So, considering Ven's case, the second term should probably renamed to "Existence Sleep!", lol
 

Dowhax

Bronze Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2009
Messages
1,139
Age
34
Existence Stop then should be put onto Aqua and Atw? I mean, they both haven't aged for being in the Realm of Darkness. But I guess it does need considering for how long one wants to think they been in there.
 

Sephiroth0812

Guardian of Light
Joined
Oct 22, 2010
Messages
10,531
Awards
37
Location
Germany
I think that "Existence Sleep!" would also apply to them in a way, as the supposed way to "return to the RoL" is the phrase Birth by Sleep.
Actually uttered by Ansem in Blank Points:

Ansem the Wise said:
"So many are still waiting for their new beginning, their birth by sleep. Even me, and even you."

The first bit is obviously referring to the other tormented ones (Ven, Terra, Roxas, Naminé, Xion etc.) while the second sentence refers to Ansem himself and Aqua.
 

BladeofHearts18

New member
Joined
Oct 31, 2009
Messages
269
Location
NY, USA
If Xehanort was smart, he would just keep releasing his heart every time he was reborn, thus creating his heartless and nobody again in a never ending cycle.

Like horcruxes? This better not turn into Harry Potter because the story is already similar to Harry Potter. LOL
 

Luap

sans 911
Joined
Oct 8, 2008
Messages
5,233
Awards
6
Age
29
Website
www.facebook.com
I'd be interested in what makes you think that, if anything KH is like star wars, no HP(sora isnt half the wuss as harry)

Yen Sid is very wise old powerful man with a beard
Dumbledore is a very wise old powerful man with a beard
MX wants to live forever.
Voldemort wants to live forever.
MX puts parts of himself in Terra, Saix, Braig and Riku and possibly others.
Voldemort puts part of himself in objects.
 

NotaHero21

New member
Joined
Dec 2, 2010
Messages
507
Age
32
Location
Where love does not reach
Yen Sid is very wise old powerful man with a beard
Dumbledore is a very wise old powerful man with a beard
MX wants to live forever.
Voldemort wants to live forever.
MX puts parts of himself in Terra, Saix, Braig and Riku and possibly others.
Voldemort puts part of himself in objects.

Yen sid doesn't have much to do with dumbldorf, especially considering he predates him :/
Xehanort does not want to live forever, he wants to destroy everything, further more he did not put pieces of himself anywhere, he took terrs's heart for his own. It was his heartless, acting independent of xehanorts direct will that scared riku's heart. I don't know where you got saix from...

Sora travels to different worlds, saves the universe and can knock skyscrapers around like toys. Harry fails at failing and turns into a soccer mom...
 

Nayru's Love

Why don't you play in Hell?
Joined
Dec 17, 2008
Messages
4,232
Awards
9
Age
31
Location
Chicago, IL
Xehanort does not want to live forever, he wants to destroy everything,
I'm not sure about living forever, but MX did show an interest in having a youthful body (kind of hard to say that with a straight face).

further more he did not put pieces of himself anywhere, he took terrs's heart for his own. It was his heartless, acting independent of xehanorts direct will that scared riku's heart. I don't know where you got saix from...
It's heavily implied that MX/Xehanort connected with Braig and Isa/Saix in some way, perhaps heart connection.
 

NotaHero21

New member
Joined
Dec 2, 2010
Messages
507
Age
32
Location
Where love does not reach
I'm not sure about living forever, but MX did show an interest in having a youthful body (kind of hard to say that with a straight face).

It's heavily implied that MX/Xehanort connected with Braig and Isa/Saix in some way, perhaps heart connection.

Did that happen in coded? Because I missed the cannon that showed that :/

Yes xehanort wanted a youthful body but his purpose was not immortality, I dont see a reason to compare a BAMF like xehanort to a wuss like moldywart
 

Nayru's Love

Why don't you play in Hell?
Joined
Dec 17, 2008
Messages
4,232
Awards
9
Age
31
Location
Chicago, IL
Did that happen in coded? Because I missed the cannon that showed that :/

The idea came from a quote of Nomura's from the BBS Plot Mysteries Interview.

-- Comparing the Organization members when they were human to when they were in the Organization, apart from Xehanort, only Isa and Braig have differently-shaped ears and differently-coloured eyes - why is this?

Nomura: It's a question of whether or not they're deeply connected to Xehanort. In Braig's case, comparing the scene where he's injured in his battle with Terra and flares up at Xehanort, his appearance afterwards changes, which hints that something happened with Xehanort in between.
 

Nayru's Love

Why don't you play in Hell?
Joined
Dec 17, 2008
Messages
4,232
Awards
9
Age
31
Location
Chicago, IL
Ehh numoras word is worth as much as are theories most of the time. I wouldn't take his word on plot until it's shown.
Theories are supposed to be predictions as to how the story will progress, to which most believe is synonymous to his word. Whether or not you feel they are synonymous is up to you. However, I doubt he would be wasting his time telling us these details if they didn't hold any water.

Regardless, Braig's change of appearance actually has been shown, so...
 
Last edited:

NotaHero21

New member
Joined
Dec 2, 2010
Messages
507
Age
32
Location
Where love does not reach
Theories are supposed to be predictions as to how the story will progress, to which most believe is synonymous to his word. Whether or not you feel they are synonymous is up to you. However, I doubt he would be wasting his time telling us these details if they didn't hold any water.

Regardless, Braig's change of appearance actually has been shown, so...

And the fact that nobodies all undergo some physical change or another means nothing? Lea changes, isa changed, sora changed, and as far as I can tell so have all the others. The effects of darkness and becoming a completely different, non-being can account for these changes without getting xehanorts influence involved.
 

Nayru's Love

Why don't you play in Hell?
Joined
Dec 17, 2008
Messages
4,232
Awards
9
Age
31
Location
Chicago, IL
And the fact that nobodies all undergo some physical change or another means nothing? Lea changes, isa changed, sora changed, and as far as I can tell so have all the others.
Not a change from Braig to Xigbar, a change from Braig to Braig (sharper ears, golden eyes)

The effects of darkness and becoming a completely different, non-being can account for these changes without getting xehanorts influence involved.
Darkness was a theorized answer, sometimes which didn't fit every situation it should have fit in.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top