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after days i saw him as more the victim that the true villain since he was just in it for getting his heart back but the way he treated Xion and roxas led me to think that he was just as evil as xemnas at firstSaiz is the one that surprised me the most. In KH2 I got the impression he was Xemnas' lap dog, but after Days he gave me a new impression.
Especially when he was tlaking to Axel about not knowing Xemnas' true goal, and what other things xemnas may not be telling them.
Organization members themselves may not all be bad. However, the purpose of the Organization is bad, whether or not most of the members even know the final purpose or not is another issue.
they werent vicious with their ways but they werent right about it tryna take kingdom hearts
I don't like to think of them as evil because all they wanted was a heart and Sora is wrong to have destroyed them.
I wonder, in recruitment did they mention that they were going to use KH? Because if the person that recruited certain member only said that they had "ways" or something then we would know that certain member is legit but we don;t see any of them join the organization so yea...
Yes the Organization was evil. Everyone seems to sympathize for them because they had a couple good seeds within their ranks (Roxas, Xion....that's about it). And no, we can't say for sure if Axel was considered a "good guy" because who knows what he did in his past to become a Nobody, especially since he had ties to Saix.
Xemnas and the other five members who established the Organization became Nobodies because they wanted to abandon the so-called "shackles of emotion" that a heart would carry.
Definitely this.
It's a pretty opinionated question to ask if they were truly bad. To me, they weren't. Well, like blt said, mostly misguided by Xemnas. Not to mention, they probably didn't see their actions as evil, they couldn't feel guilt, if no one had emotions, no one would be able to judge what was right or wrong. Just saying.
I really don't think it's fair to judge Axel based on how he was as a somebody. I think, if anything, he is significantly different from his somebody especially since Roxas joined. You can't pin his somebody's actions on him
So you are saying that the original members became nobodies because they wanted to, and they didn't want a heart? But that's stupid because why would they want to turn right back around and thrive to have hearts so much?
That's exactly what I'm saying. In fact, that is what the game tells us. They intentionally were consumed by darkness so that they could escape the "shackles of the heart" that Saix mentions. However, once they did do so, they realized that there are some things you cannot do without a heart, and therefore sought a way to not only regain their hearts, but obtain the power of Kingdom Hearts (also mentioned in the game itself).
Those were only said for the Apprentices: the first six. Not everyone else. Nomura mentioned it, from what I can remember. The one who wrote it was Xaldin, I believe. And guess what he is? In the end, the report is still in his opinion. So what he thinks isn't exactly what the rest of his past colleagues would think before they all befell Darkness. All they have in common is that they chose the same path before knowing the consequences.
Innocent question, don't butcher me: When did the Org. ever turn anyone into a Heartless intentionally?
Don't say Beast. Besides him.
(Wasn't that Xaldin acting on his own, anyway?)
Seriously, people have been saying that since KH2, I guess I just never got the memo. When did that happen (besides with Beast)? I was under the impression Sora came up with that idea himself.
It was strongly implied that the Organization was responsible for turning the dragon in The Land of Dragons into a Heartless.
There were a few cases, though, where Sora said that the Organization was trying to set Heartless on people, and there was never any proof of it. I'd say that, generally speaking, it's best to assume that the Organization's wrongdoings - apart from restraining the hearts comprising Kingdom Hearts - were of a more personal sort than the generalized evil that the Disney villains were involved in, and that Sora's belief otherwise was based on assumption rather than fact.