Kingdom Hearts 3 Story Discussion

[Squood!]

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I don't really have a problem with anything in the story, but this one thing irks me.

Can Donald and Goofy stop treating Sora like crap when Mickey shows up? Shoving him away, slamming his head into a seat, not giving him a chance to talk....seriously guys you literally saw Mickey yesterday.

As for Xion....I dunno either but I guess her having the crazy memory headache is supposed to be a hint or something.

 

[Elysium]

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I just finished the game. (Re-watching that ending cinematic after I did, SO pretty.) I love love loved it. I haven’t watched the Secret Ending—will have to look it up later—but I had a question. Did I miss something re: Vexen / Demyx? I thought that would be followed up on after Vexen enlists Demyx to help him and then Demyx delivers Ansem the Wise to Ienzo, but they never showed up again until the ending cinematic when Namine is being revived. Did they just return to normal once Xehanort died even with the nort heart and golden eyes? And who was Vexen receiving orders from (which he whispered in Demyx’s ear)?

Anyway, Xion’s and Isa’s new outfits look okay, but I loved Lea’s. That beach scene at the end was everything. I guess I don’t really want all these characters to go away…. I’d really like to see more of Isa interacting with RAX + Namine + HPO. TAV seems like the characters the most easily discarded post-3, but I like Aqua, and Terra, too, to a lesser degree... And I’m guessing we definitely *will* see Larxene, Marluxia, and Luxord again on top of the apprentices and Demyx, which I'm happy about.

I didn’t take the scenes with Sora and Kairi as outright romantic, whether or not they were intended that way. The earlier scene with them sharing the paopus felt like Kairi being worried they might be separated again and the paopu was her way of believing they wouldn’t be (would be funny if it turned out paopu’s had real power though, lol). After I first saw the cinematic, for some reason I assumed everyone turned to the paopu tree because Sora and Kairi had just appeared there, Riku’s face looked like he knew something was wrong because Kairi was crying, and Kairi was crying because she knew Sora was about to disappear in exchange for bringing her back. But when I wrote the above about Namine, I realized Sora and Kairi must’ve been there for a while because otherwise how would Namine have been brought back if Kairi was off who knows where since Namine said she was attached to Kairi and if Kairi was in the Final World, too, then there was no way for them to revive Namine until she was found? Or could Namine have been revived without Kairi being present?

I loved the part in the Final World with the stars. I wasn’t crazy about Isa and Lea being turned into a trio, but I’m curious about the storyline of this girl and how she was used as some kind of lab rat? I haven’t kept up with Chi, so I know nothing about Chi or Ephemer. I assumed that Maleficent and Pete’s final scene was her going into the past somehow (ie, her appearance in that Chi game).

I might go back and read some of the posts I've skipped to avoid being spoiled.

 

[Ballad of Caius]

Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia! Mamma Mia!

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Just finished Monstropolis. I thought it was a good world, but a tad boring. Loved how Vanitas appeared. His remixed theme, and Haley enjoying his role really helped into cementing him as a serious threat.

 

[ZeVaine]

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If Ventus was one of the Leaders of the dandelions how did he end up in the generation with Aqua and Terra? Or do they take place in the same generation?

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Therein lies one of the biggest questions that I can only begin to speculate about.

1) The Union leaders all, somehow, become nobodies, and as such, do not age... but never grow individual hearts for some reason? Flawed explanation. Perhaps they become nobodies, but are kept in some kind of stasis for some reason... a state of sleep like Ven goes through for most the KH series. (Though having him do that twice seems silly?)

2) The whole Union Cross scenario we are playing is actually within a sleeping world - and as such, events occur that cause the world to awaken; freeing these individuals to the time not long before BBS; though at the cost of them, for some reason, loosing most of their memories in the sleeping simulated Daybreak Town world.

 

[mriku90]

So "Let it Go" was basically Sora, Donald, and Goofy just gawking in the background? Seriously? I know Elsa wanted to distance herself from them but I would have liked it better if they did a different spin on the song. Instead of just a copy and paste

I was more shocked at how incredible it looked, very impressive segment.

 

[Zettaflare]

So I just finished Arendelle and watched a cutscene with the new organization. Nomura wasted no time confirming Demyx and Luxord came from the Chi era as well, lol I really shouldn't be surprised

 

[Elysium]

I was more shocked at how incredible it looked, very impressive segment.

Me, too. Well, that and I still find the song and Idina Menzel's voice amazing, too. :tongue: I wouldn't find it believable for Elsa to still sing knowing they were there. She was freaked out by being around people for the whole first movie, even after she's built her ice palace.

 

[SerDuncan]

Okay, I know this is off topic from the rest of this discussion, but I'm in bad shape right now.

I literally just made an account so I could get some thoughts out quickly.

I beat the game, so these are full story spoilers INCLUDING the Epilogue and the Secret Movie... kinda

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I absolutely hated the story starting from the arrival in the Keyblade Graveyard... all the way to the end of the Secret Movie. As a Kingdom Hearts fan since 358/2 Days came out, I've never been more disappointed in the way something has concluded. Sure, I struggled a bit with the ending of Dream Drop, but nothing has ever hit me so badly the way this game has. I'm sure part of it was that I didn't lower my expectations enough but... I mean, seriously? We had entire games dedicated to villains and character's whose entire plotlines and arcs were wrapped up in the course of a single cutscene. The sea salt trio had me a bit misty eyed... until I realized that we weren't going to get anything else from them. A few hugs, a tear or two.. hardly any interaction... is that how their arc concludes? After the tears shed, the bonds broken... Roxas and Xion just show up, Axel says a few one liners... and that's it. Or how about the BBS trio? "And that was the last night we ever shared beneath the same stars". Except, nope! Terra is totally fine, Ventus is fine, Aqua is fine... and they all lived happily ever after. All that build up from Dream Drop... all that build up from 0.2... and it ends in the matter of a cutscene or two. Am I crazy in thinking that this whole finale felt... so rushed and half-assed? We hardly got to know anybody... and it feels like we were supposed to. Ventus and Roxas didn't even talk about how they look alike... Kairi and Axel didn't get to show off their skills... I legitimately started my second playthrough yesterday... and just had to set the controller down and cry. I know that's ridiculous... not even crying over a piece of story in the game. Crying because the game didn't turn out how I wanted. But at the same time, THIS is now the canon finale to all these character's arcs. Master Xehanort became a good guy I guess, the twists foreshadowed in previous games sorta just happen.

I don't know what it is I need right now... do I just want to rant and find people who agree with me? Or am I looking for someone to tell me that my points are wrong? At this point, I'm not even excited for KH4. Nomura foregoing the previous characters in favor of more sequel bait like the box or the foretellers just puts a bad taste in my mouth for the whole next plotline.

It just sucks. I beat the game Wednesday, and I'm been thinking about it every day since then, trying to think about what was good, what was bad... if I'm just being too harsh or not... at this point, I just feel crushed.

 

[Aws]

Okay, I know this is off topic from the rest of this discussion, but I'm in bad shape right now.

I literally just made an account so I could get some thoughts out quickly.

I beat the game, so these are full story spoilers INCLUDING the Epilogue and the Secret Movie... kinda

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I absolutely hated the story starting from the arrival in the Keyblade Graveyard... all the way to the end of the Secret Movie. As a Kingdom Hearts fan since 358/2 Days came out, I've never been more disappointed in the way something has concluded. Sure, I struggled a bit with the ending of Dream Drop, but nothing has ever hit me so badly the way this game has. I'm sure part of it was that I didn't lower my expectations enough but... I mean, seriously? We had entire games dedicated to villains and character's whose entire plotlines and arcs were wrapped up in the course of a single cutscene. The sea salt trio had me a bit misty eyed... until I realized that we weren't going to get anything else from them. A few hugs, a tear or two.. hardly any interaction... is that how their arc concludes? After the tears shed, the bonds broken... Roxas and Xion just show up, Axel says a few one liners... and that's it. Or how about the BBS trio? "And that was the last night we ever shared beneath the same stars". Except, nope! Terra is totally fine, Ventus is fine, Aqua is fine... and they all lived happily ever after. All that build up from Dream Drop... all that build up from 0.2... and it ends in the matter of a cutscene or two. Am I crazy in thinking that this whole finale felt... so rushed and half-assed? We hardly got to know anybody... and it feels like we were supposed to. Ventus and Roxas didn't even talk about how they look alike... Kairi and Axel didn't get to show off their skills... I legitimately started my second playthrough yesterday... and just had to set the controller down and cry. I know that's ridiculous... not even crying over a piece of story in the game. Crying because the game didn't turn out how I wanted. But at the same time, THIS is now the canon finale to all these character's arcs. Master Xehanort became a good guy I guess, the twists foreshadowed in previous games sorta just happen.

I don't know what it is I need right now... do I just want to rant and find people who agree with me? Or am I looking for someone to tell me that my points are wrong? At this point, I'm not even excited for KH4. Nomura foregoing the previous characters in favor of more sequel bait like the box or the foretellers just puts a bad taste in my mouth for the whole next plotline.

It just sucks. I beat the game Wednesday, and I'm been thinking about it every day since then, trying to think about what was good, what was bad... if I'm just being too harsh or not... at this point, I just feel crushed.

I am in quite a similar situation; been a complete emotional wreck since beating the game on Wednesday, skipped class on Thursday and Friday, but now I'm feeling slightly better after scouring all the forums I know for discussions about the game and the ending.

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I liked the Keyblade Graveyard as a whole up to when Kairi got kidnapped. I felt that that was quite useless and unnecessary and just a lazy way for Normua to avoid doing narrative cleanup after Sora and Kairi's intimate moment at the end of the Final World. I agree with what you said about the trios and their endings, although we did see them again in the actual ending after the final boss fight, but to me it felt like the narrative was compressed. I'm not calling it rushed because most of it was there but there was definitely more that could have been done. The amount of cleanup that could have been done to give every single character closure could have extended the game by a few hours after the final boss fight, but alas, Nomura wanted his gatcha cliffhanger at the end.

And speaking of that cliffhanger, wtf? That ending ruined me. Everyone was happy and playing on the beach except for Sora and Kairi who coincidentally happen to be my favorite characters, which adds to my frustration with Nomura for this game because Kairi was being hyped up to be a fully-fledged character this time around but instead she was absent outside of one scene for the entirety of the game prior to the Keyblade Graveyard wherein she swung her Keyblade like 3 times and then got grabbed. What's even more annoying about the situation with Kairi to me is the fact that Nomura finally gave her some nice scenes with Sora only to go back to the usual Damsel-in-Distress BS. But I digress, the ending was painful for me because I did not get any closure for Sora and Kairi after 13 years of waiting, and I say 13 because Kairi really didn't have any presence after KH2. There was no reason for everyone to get a happy ending EXCEPT for Sora and Kairi and the way he disappeared was also quite annoying. We already have a lot of reasons to be excited for the future of the series and are already quite sequel-baited from the epilogue, the box, the mystery girl, Marluxia/Larxene/Luxord/Demyx's future (Especially Luxord whose future friendship with Sora is going to be awesome!). We didn't need another sad ending to buy the next game. This sequel baiting was cheap and inconsiderate, especially since KH3 was supposed to provide closure and resolve all the previous sequel-baiting from the previous games and wasn't supposed to contain a gotcha cliffhanger ending like KH2, which is an easier ending to swallow than this one.

Final note: I really don't get why Nomura had to single out Sora and Kairi to suffer when everyone else who was dead was easily brought back without any problem. A part of me says it's all because of the secret ending with the Yozora and possible TWEWY tease; Nomura just wanted to kill Sora so he'd get his TWEWY2 + FFVersus XIII moment that he wasn't allowed to make? Sure it looks awesome but it doesn't justify treating Sora and Kairi like that. I really hope Nomura gives us a DLC that focuses entirely on Sora's journey to return Kairi where she is the main focus and is provided with the screen-time necessary to build up her character, but from the secret ending Nomura just seems to have gone mad and from his track record I very much doubt that he will ever give Kairi the role she deserves, which is quite depressing because it really seemed like KH3 was going to fix her character but it did not, after 13 years of hype and waiting. I just don't trust Nomura anymore and it's quite a shock to me because KH has always been the constantly positive thing in my life that I looked forward to and kept me going. I don't think I can handle another 13 years of waiting after everything that happened in my life and after realizing how fallible Nomura is as a writer.

 

[SerDuncan]

I am in quite a similar situation; been a complete emotional wreck since beating the game on Wednesday, skipped class on Thursday and Friday, but now I'm feeling slightly better after scouring all the forums I know for discussions about the game and the ending.

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I liked the Keyblade Graveyard as a whole up to when Kairi got kidnapped. I felt that that was quite useless and unnecessary and just a lazy way for Normua to avoid doing narrative cleanup after Sora and Kairi's intimate moment at the end of the Final World. I agree with what you said about the trios and their endings, although we did see them again in the actual ending after the final boss fight, but to me it felt like the narrative was compressed. I'm not calling it rushed because most of it was there but there was definitely more that could have been done. The amount of cleanup that could have been done to give every single character closure could have extended the game by a few hours after the final boss fight, but alas, Nomura wanted his gatcha cliffhanger at the end.

And speaking of that cliffhanger, wtf? That ending ruined me. Everyone was happy and playing on the beach except for Sora and Kairi who coincidentally happen to be my favorite characters, which adds to my frustration with Nomura for this game because Kairi was being hyped up to be a fully-fledged character this time around but instead she was absent outside of one scene for the entirety of the game prior to the Keyblade Graveyard wherein she swung her Keyblade like 3 times and then got grabbed. What's even more annoying about the situation with Kairi to me is the fact that Nomura finally gave her some nice scenes with Sora only to go back to the usual Damsel-in-Distress BS. But I digress, the ending was painful for me because I did not get any closure for Sora and Kairi after 13 years of waiting, and I say 13 because Kairi really didn't have any presence after KH2. There was no reason for everyone to get a happy ending EXCEPT for Sora and Kairi and the way he disappeared was also quite annoying. We already have a lot of reasons to be excited for the future of the series and are already quite sequel-baited from the epilogue, the box, the mystery girl, Marluxia/Larxene/Luxord/Demyx's future (Especially Luxord whose future friendship with Sora is going to be awesome!). We didn't need another sad ending to buy the next game. This sequel baiting was cheap and inconsiderate, especially since KH3 was supposed to provide closure and resolve all the previous sequel-baiting from the previous games and wasn't supposed to contain a gotcha cliffhanger ending like KH2, which is an easier ending to swallow than this one.

Final note: I really don't get why Nomura had to single out Sora and Kairi to suffer when everyone else who was dead was easily brought back without any problem. A part of me says it's all because of the secret ending with the Yozora and possible TWEWY tease; Nomura just wanted to kill Sora so he'd get his TWEWY2 + FFVersus XIII moment that he wasn't allowed to make? Sure it looks awesome but it doesn't justify treating Sora and Kairi like that. I really hope Nomura gives us a DLC that focuses entirely on Sora's journey to return Kairi where she is the main focus and is provided with the screen-time necessary to build up her character, but from the secret ending Nomura just seems to have gone mad and from his track record I very much doubt that he will ever give Kairi the role she deserves, which is quite depressing because it really seemed like KH3 was going to fix her character but it did not, after 13 years of hype and waiting. I just don't trust Nomura anymore and it's quite a shock to me because KH has always been the constantly positive thing in my life that I looked forward to and kept me going. I don't think I can handle another 13 years of waiting after everything that happened in my life and after realizing how fallible Nomura is as a writer.

Sorry for copying all of this, I'm new to this system here.

You hit everything right on the head for me. I was so disappointed. I mean, yeah, the series has been convoluted, the writing bad at times, the story a little rough around the edges. But never before has it felt so plain that Nomura was done with the series. He pretty much just said at some point. "I'm tired of all these characters and plot threads, I'm ready to move on to KHUX". In retrospect, a lot of his comments in interviews and his comments in the art book reflect this mentality. He has this apologetic, tired tone where he's kinda like... I was tired, this was tiring, I know you'll be mad and I'm sorry. Maybe that's just me.

And the sequel baiting... my lord, it was horrendous! No other Kingdom Hearts game had as much bait for future series as this one. Especially since so much of it was pushing players to play the gatcha game which Nomura himself wouldn't be necessary to play for KH3. Spoiler alert, it kinda was. If you hadn't played it and only watched Back Cover, so many subtle things would be lost. I don't even know how to put into words everything I feel right now.

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And while I didn't necessarily want Sora and Kairi to get a happy ending like you did, I was so frustrated at the BS ending we DID get. I literally laughed as Sora disappeared because it was such an asspull. He vanishes into the darkness? I guess? Saved Kairi offscreen while his friends are laughing having a good time? It was such a frustrating moment because it had been built up throughout the latter half of the game "you're going too far" and then it casually drops at the end. Mannnnnn I just... ugh. Too many emotions right now.

 

[Aws]

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And while I didn't necessarily want Sora and Kairi to get a happy ending like you did, I was so frustrated at the BS ending we DID get. I literally laughed as Sora disappeared because it was such an asspull. He vanishes into the darkness? I guess? Saved Kairi offscreen while his friends are laughing having a good time? It was such a frustrating moment because it had been built up throughout the latter half of the game "you're going too far" and then it casually drops at the end. Mannnnnn I just... ugh. Too many emotions right now.

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If they didn't get a happy ending but it was done correctly I might have been ok with it, but having Kairi die for no reason than having Sora go after her, whatever that meant, off-screen only to get an ambiguous scene at the last ~5 seconds of the game that doesn't really tell us anything other than "These two are ****ed." The ending doesn't really say anything; we don't even know if Sora and Kairi were really there to begin with and weren't just symbolically there like in the BBS Blank Points ending with Ventus and Terra staring up at the sky and saying Sora. For all we know she's still dead and he's still searching, hence she's crying and he's disappeared. Or maybe he found her and died in the process, or they're both dead, etc. There is no canon explanation and that's part of why I hate that ending so much. The other part is that we didn't get anything after the heavily implied romantic scenes between them because Nomura lazily killed her and avoided the topic altogether. From my knowledge of human beings you don't just ignore one another after having such moments and so if she hadn't been killed Nomura would have had to do some narrative cleanup (which he seems to hate doing). Even at the ending when they are together we don't get anything. Sora simply fades away and that's quite a cheap way to end their story after 13 years.

Hope I'm not ranting too much on this topic y'all. Been forever since I logged into my account and my friends irl haven't played the game yet so I have no one to vent to.

 

[NobodyImportant]

So "Let it Go" was basically Sora, Donald, and Goofy just gawking in the background? Seriously? I know Elsa wanted to distance herself from them but I would have liked it better if they did a different spin on the song. Instead of just a copy and paste

It was said in a couple interviews that Disney put an immense pressure on SE not to 'ruin' their cash cow. So basically, SDG weren't allowed to interfere in the story at all. So they tossed in Larxene with the ice maze to give us something to do while plot happened offscreen. I noticed a similar thing with Tangled; while SDG had to go fight monsters, plot happened offscreen. I guess they couldn't figure out what to do with them in the pub scene. Then again, considering that was basically just a musical number in the movies, it probably needed to be cut.

Actually come to think of it, that was probably the main reason the majority of the plot from most of those worlds were glossed over. Three songs being sung in the game was enough for me. (Yo ho yo ho a pirate's life for me... xD)

 

[DarkosOverlord]

Hope I'm not ranting too much on this topic y'all. Been forever since I logged into my account and my friends irl haven't played the game yet so I have no one to vent to.

This is a topic worth ranting on imo.
The series was juggling these specific narrative balls for years and they didn't drop them, they practically slam dunked them on the ground.

I also feel a bit bad that the points I have to make are mostly negative ones... KH III DID do good things and it's not a bad game by any means... but then again, on these issues I feel like we're not wrong to be disappointed.

 

[Zettaflare]

Really loving The Caribbean so far. I knew it was going to be my favorite Disney world and boy did it not disappoint. I dont even mind the White crab hunt cause it means I get to explore more of the gorgeous town of Port Royal. So happy this world got a second chance

It was said in a couple interviews that Disney put an immense pressure on SE not to 'ruin' their cash cow. So basically, SDG weren't allowed to interfere in the story at all. So they tossed in Larxene with the ice maze to give us something to do while plot happened offscreen. I noticed a similar thing with Tangled; while SDG had to go fight monsters, plot happened offscreen. I guess they couldn't figure out what to do with them in the pub scene. Then again, considering that was basically just a musical number in the movies, it probably needed to be cut.

Actually come to think of it, that was probably the main reason the majority of the plot from most of those worlds were glossed over. Three songs being sung in the game was enough for me. (Yo ho yo ho a pirate's life for me... xD)

I just dont get how SDG's presence would ruin the plot. If anything it would enrich it. Because of this limits Arendelle's plot really suffered

 

[Sakuraba Neku]

Going through Kingdom of Corona. The Disney Worlds are amazing, but the Originals Worlds have been disappointing me:

- Twilight Town is richer but smaller. There are cutscenes happening inside the mansion and later at the clock tower and we can't either go inside the mansion or the station.

- Riku is only playable during the boss fight so far and we can't even explore a little of Realm of Darkness with him.

- The Radiant Garden cutscenes are such a tease and the reason Riku/Mickey go there actually makes sense. I definitely want a playable scenario as DLC, even though it should already be in the base game.

 

[mriku90]

Really loving The Caribbean so far. I knew it was going to be my favorite Disney world and boy did it not disappoint. I dont even mind the White crab hunt cause it means I get to explore more of the gorgeous town of Port Royal. So happy this world got a second chance


I just dont get how SDG's presence would ruin the plot. If anything it would enrich it. Because of this limits Arendelle's plot really suffered

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Going from the end of that world and what Larxene said, Frozen will be coming back. Hopefully they can follow the next plot line from the film.

 

[Zul]

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[DarkosOverlord]

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why OF COURSE

It all makes sense now
For once the Secret Movie was actually understandable, we just didn't know better

 

[Elysium]

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There was no reason for everyone to get a happy ending EXCEPT for Sora and Kairi and the way he disappeared was also quite annoying.

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I really doubt anyone else on the beach--but especially Riku, Donald, and Goofy--are "happy" in this ending where Sora disappeared. The closeup on Riku's face as they see it happen makes that clear.

I guess I'm not bothered by the ending. The KH1 ending was so much more emotional for me back when because at the time we weren't completely sure there would even be a sequel to KH, plus I was broken up that Riku was on the other side of the door (unsure to return) and SDG were in the middle of nowhere all alone. KH3's ending just has me hyped for the next game since I know Sora will be fine, which was their intention, I suppose. I'll be angry if the next game is a on a handheld with nothing to do with Sora or Riku and no follow-up on what happens after KH3's ending.

 

[FudgemintGuardian]

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