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Remind scenario parts I didn't quite understood



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AegisXIII

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Could you please help me with some parts that are still blurry to me?

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Thanks in advance.
 

okhi12

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These are my main issues with ReMind as well, so if anybody can explain I'd be grateful.
 

Twilight Lumiair

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Yeah, these things confounded me too. As did most of the dlc.

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Noivern

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Yeah, these things confounded me too. As did most of the dlc.


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I actually completely forgot that Riku kinda got the Power of Waking as well? Maybe because 3D caused me so much pain that I rushed through that game as fast as I could, but.. wow. And they never once address it in KH3.. no wonder I forgot about it. lol
 

Twilight Lumiair

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I actually completely forgot that Riku kinda got the Power of Waking as well? Maybe because 3D caused me so much pain that I rushed through that game as fast as I could, but.. wow. And they never once address it in KH3.. no wonder I forgot about it. lol
Yeah... and this is the very premise of the dlc too. Can't blame you for forgetting when the writers themselves clearly did, lol.
 
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AegisXIII

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And what about my second point? That's the one that bothers me the most.
 

MRKDH

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4.I think because he already travelled through 5 hearts and found 5 pieces.
5.Maybe i‘m wrong but didn‘t any1 say (don‘t ask me who i don‘t know it anymore, maybe Larxene?) that the 7 princesses were their plan B in case the guardians refused to fight the organisation, because they needed 7 lights against 13 darknesses? And kairi is still 1 of them.
 
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Yeah... and this is the very premise of the dlc too. Can't blame you for forgetting when the writers themselves clearly did, lol.
What makes it even weirder is that the game's glossary actually ays Riku has the power of waking and King Mickey does too, with no reason and no consequence.

I honestly thought ReMind would make KH3 make sense but it just made it clear to me that Nomura is j really ust making it up as he goes along.
 

Twilight Lumiair

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And what about my second point? That's the one that bothers me the most.
I honestly think it was just an oversight. It's possible the writers may have simply miscounted, or perhaps the thought Sora abusing the PoW 7 times was just to hard to digest.

Though it does make Sora's decision to go back instead of Riku (and apparently Mickey) even more dubious.
Maybe i‘m wrong but didn't someone say (don‘t ask me who i don‘t know it anymore, maybe Larxene?) that the 7 princesses were their plan B in case the guardians refused to fight the Organization, because they needed 7 lights against 13 darknesses? And Kairi is still 1 of them.
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What makes it even weirder is that the game's glossary actually says Riku has the power of waking and King Mickey does too, with no reason and no consequence.

I honestly thought ReMind would make KH3 make sense, but it just made it clear to me that Nomura is really just making it up as he goes along.
Woooow, so in addition to Riku's PoW being ignored, they also retconned in Mickey having the PoW too? WHY???? That just makes it so much worse 😫

Honestly, just based off the trailers, I never personally expected ReMind to be able to make sense of KH3. The premise was just flawed from the get go.
 

MRKDH

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Aahh ok. Then the only other reason i can think of is: the x-blade was destroyed or rather he almost had it once so maybe he wanted to be sure he can summon it again, in case it will be destroyed again.
 

AR829038

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As someone who loved base KH3 and also loved ReMIND, I think it's important to note that ReMIND's success was in spite of Nomura's storytelling, not because of it. The graphics, Shimomura's music, and now the new and improved Osaka team gameplay are what's keeping this series afloat right now; Nomura needs to either sit down in a room for a month and formulate where he actually wants to take this story before it spirals totally out of his control, or he needs to hire writers to draft the scripts for his ideas, because the writing cannot continue going down this path of absolute nonsense and contrivance for much longer.
 

AdrianXXII

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1. Sora already used the power of waking to rewrite history. He didn't disappear. Now, he uses the power of waking to find Kairi back WITHOUT changing history and he disappears? Why? What is so bad about saving Kairi compared to the others?

Personally I think he was already set to disappear. He already broke the nature taboo, saving Kairi probably just accelerated the process. Young Xehanort did already say there was no saving him, even way before he went to save Kairi.

4. How does Sora come to the realisation that traversing each gardians heart will reconstruct Kairi?

Well Chirithy stated that going to the different guardians would lead him to Kairi's heart, so he probably figured he'd return to the original plan after making his Scala detour.

I'm not entirely sure how he got the last two pieces that way though. My guess is that either the Replicas had the last few pieces or that he could use the light of the other guardians, that'd lead him to Kairi, to summon the pieces to him.

Honestly I feel like the oddness of those scenes are the results of them changing the plans regarding how Sora would get back to Kairi mid development or something.

5. Why does Xehanort need Kairi as an insurance to open Kingdom Hearts? The seven princesses were used to open the door to darkness to reach the artificial kingdom hearts made by ansem. Nothing more.

Well the 7 hearts of light do also serve the purpose of maintaining the Realm of Light in the absence of Kingdom Hearts and as Kairi has demonstrated through out the series they come with Deus Ex Machina Powers, that Xehanort might have had use for.

Ansem and Xemnas stated they like having multiple irons in the fire, this is just another example of it.

They can, they do, and they absolutely did. Welcome to KH3 🤣

A better question would be why Sora bothered interfering in the first place when he A) knew the rules of time travel would prevent him from making any changes to the outcome of the battle, B) didn't want either of them to get hurt because he thought it would be "bad for Terra", and C) had no reason to think LW couldn't handle Terranort (since the only thing he saw was the former handing the latter his ass).

I could go on with the problems of this section, but I'm too tired, lol. Honestly, the whole sequence is meaningless anyway, so I wouldn't personally dwell on it.

Honestly they should have just had Sora fight the darkness in Terra's heart which took on the form of Terranort instead of having him jump into "the real world" and fight Terranort. A cutscene of Terranort crushing Lingering Will's helmet the way he was about to before Sora jumped in would have been enough.

Sora could have jumped to try and reach Terra only to be swallowed by darkness until Ven and Aqua's calls for Terra would wake both him and Terra up.
 

Wallflower3582

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I don't know for sure what the answer to question #1 is, like everyone else, but the way my brain sort of explained it without me realizing it is this: the first time Sora used the power of waking to rewind time and restore the Guardians hearts to the moment before everything went wrong. At that point, everything that has just happened was now up in the air again, time had been unwritten, so it could change without causing a paradox. The second time Sora used the power of waking was to break into the already established, unchangeable timeline and pull Kairi out of it. He was trying to do something physically impossible: there was no way he could be present twice in the KG—one version to play out the events as they did in the base game, a second to save Kairi and save her without disrupting the events leading up to Xehanort's defeat—without breaking the laws of nature. He was trying to have his cake and eat it too. If he had tried to rewind time to save Kairi like he did the other Guardians, then the future where they had succeeded in defeating Xehanort the way that they did would cease to exist. Sora was trying to extract Kairi from the timeline without undoing the victory he had already attained, which is why Chirithy said that it was different this time.

The amount of proof I have for this is little more than a headcanon, but it gives me more peace of mind to think of it this way than to just dismiss it as unexplainable.

Edit: Actually here's a bit of my proof. In the Ultimania Nomura says "the impact of forcing his friends' fading hearts back the way they were rewrote reality, and created a singularity. The rewrite caused the chronology in which they were destroyed to have 'never happened.'" Which is obviously not what was happening in ReMind, so… I dunno.
 
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D

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I don't know for sure what the answer to question #1 is, like everyone else, but the way my brain sort of explained it without me realizing it is this: the first time Sora used the power of waking to rewind time and restore the Guardians hearts to the moment before everything went wrong. At that point, everything that has just happened was now up in the air again, time had been unwritten, so it could change without causing a paradox. The second time Sora used the power of waking was to break into the already established, unchangeable timeline and pull Kairi out of it. He was trying to do something physically impossible: there was no way he could be present twice in the KG—one version to play out the events as they did in the base game, a second to save Kairi and save her without disrupting the events leading up to Xehanort's defeat—without breaking the laws of nature. He was trying to have his cake and eat it too. If he had tried to rewind time to save Kairi like he did the other Guardians, then the future where they had succeeded in defeating Xehanort the way that they did would cease to exist. Sora was trying to extract Kairi from the timeline without undoing the victory he had already attained, which is why Chirithy said that it was different this time.

The amount of proof I have for this is little more than a headcanon, but it gives me more peace of mind to think of it this way than to just dismiss it as unexplainable.

Edit: Actually here's a bit of my proof. In the Ultimania Nomura says "the impact of forcing his friends' fading hearts back the way they were rewrote reality, and created a singularity. The rewrite caused the chronology in which they were destroyed to have 'never happened.'" Which is obviously not what was happening in ReMind, so… I dunno.
But if them being destroyed by the demon tide 'never happened', how can Sora start by going back to Terranort attacking them the first time? It makes no sense.​
 

Wallflower3582

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But if them being destroyed by the demon tide 'never happened', how can Sora start by going back to Terranort attacking them the first time? It makes no sense.​
Time was rewound to the point right before Terra-Nort wiped them out. Time began progressing from that point much like it did the first time, but as Namine had reached out to Lingering Will, there was a new event that triggered a change, giving them a new ending. The version of time where they had been destroyed by the Demon Tide had been unwritten and therefore had "never happened."
 
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Time was rewound to the point right before Terra-Nort wiped them out. Time began progressing from that point much like it did the first time, but as Namine had reached out to Lingering Will, there was a new event that triggered a change, giving them a new ending. The version of time where they had been destroyed by the Demon Tide had been unwritten and therefore had "never happened."
But at the start of ReMind, when Sora connects to Ven and Aqua's hearts, he goes back to the time without the Lingering Will where Terranort smashes Ven etc. so this version of events still 'exists'. Really a different worldline is the only semi-logical way to explain it but that doesn't seem to be the case hence my confusion.
 

AdrianXXII

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But at the start of ReMind, when Sora connects to Ven and Aqua's hearts, he goes back to the time without the Lingering Will where Terranort smashes Ven etc. so this version of events still 'exists'. Really a different worldline is the only semi-logical way to explain it but that doesn't seem to be the case hence my confusion.
Honestly the way remind treats it, it seems that both events of the Keyblade graveyard happened in the same timeline, just instead of a straight forward timeline it's one that has a jagged shape form the rewind for when the the events overlap. I'm basically picturing the timeline having an odd Z shape for where the Keyblade Graveyard events begin.
 
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Honestly the way remind treats it, it seems that both events of the Keyblade graveyard happened in the same timeline, just instead of a straight forward timeline it's one that has a jagged shape form the rewind for when the the events overlap. I'm basically picturing the timeline having an odd Z shape for where the Keyblade Graveyard events begin.
Okay, that makes sort of sense. Still, my original point about it still having happened stands but it's not really that big a deal in the end, given that there seem to already be myriad sets of rules for time travel in the series.

EDIT: Actually, the DLC adds terms to the glossary, including one on the 'Tear in the Fabric of Time' which says that

'A new world without defeat was born, creating two contradictory histories within the same timeline'

So both do exist in some way, in separate 'worlds' of a kind.

Incidentally, the entry on Young Xehanort's experiements is interesting
 
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AegisXIII

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Okay so we need to clear this time travel thing.

What I am sure is that Sora didn't modify the timeline in remind. It's a closed loop, just like YX explained in DDD. The question is:
How was he able to break a nature taboo in the first timeline? Shouldn't be that easy.
Was he gonna disappear anyway regardless of saving Kairi? If yes, why not modify the timeline once again if he was still doomed to vanish?

What concerns me is that in KH3: chirithy encourages Sora to use the power of waking: "Haven't you already learned how to restore a heart after it's been completely lost?"
And in remind, he seems worried about it. like oh my gosh you broke the rules.
Why?
 

MRKDH

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In KH3 it was his 1st time using this power and the hearts weren’t destroyed/ shattered like Kairis. Maybe it’s something else if a heart is just lost in the darkness (or whatever happened to them) and not destroyed. That’s why chirithy encouraged Sora in KH3. At least that’s what i think. 🤔
 
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