TAV Keyblades: Keychainless?

[Smile]

I'd like to point the fact that LS's keyblade CAN have a keychain since it does have a hole in it's handle.

The LS's Keyblade can have a Keychain because Terra's Keyblade had the same hole on it, and the LS is a reflection of Terra.
Keeping in mind however how the entire canonity of the fight and LS even being there is questionable, added with the fact it's probably not Terra, his Keyblade is redundant until further notice.

The keyblade itself is real. However the source of it's power might come from the keychains.

Which Keyblade are you talking about? And keep in mind fake Keyblades are in existence.
Also, donno about you, but should TAV's weapons truly be Keyblades, they seem mighty powerful enough without a Keychain.
And, ya know... I can't really say any power comes from the Sweet Memories Keychain. How would you explain that

 

[Ordeith]

I'd like to point the fact that LS's keyblade CAN have a keychain since it does have a hole in it's handle.

The keyblade itself is real.

Both of those facts have already been established to be true; what we're trying to do now is search through the previous games for a precedent of this, namely in Riku's Soul Eater, but there has been some difficulty in doing this due to the similarities shown by chainless keyblades and false keyblade. So far, only one false keyblade we've seen actually has a chain, and the remainder have all been without, thus causing the confusion in regards to a precedent to a chainless keyblade that was also genuine.

 

[Smile]

Actually, the past examples are kind of contradictory.

We have the Heart Unlocker - fake, no Keychain.

Xion's Keyblade - assumed fake, yes Keychain.

Soul Eater - not a Keyblade, no Keychain.

And TAV's are still a big question mark.
Thus far, we have no pattern to follow.

 

[Ordeith]

Actually, the past examples are kind of contradictory.

We have the Heart Unlocker - fake, no Keychain.

Xion's Keyblade - assumed fake, yes Keychain.

Soul Eater - not a Keyblade, no Keychain.

And TAV's are still a big question mark.
Thus far, we have no pattern to follow.

And yet the Soul Eater had the potential to become a keyblade, and did, which coincides with what is stated in this theory.
It might not have been a keyblade at the time that it still was the Soul Eater, but it still was (A) a weapon formed from a person's heart and (B) transformed into a fully geniune keyblade, chain and all, both of those qualities being shared with TAV's keyblades, the latter presumably.

 

[Smile]

If we want to go there, yes. But it's a single occurrence, still that also has its share of differences.

 

[Ordeith]

If we want to go there, yes. But it's a single occurrence, still that also has its share of differences.

Hm, true; I'm just attempting to make the most out of what we have....If only one of us could pose as a N.E.I.L. long enough to pump Nomura for information....
Anyways, something that I can't help but ponder: Why is it that in the concept video, none of our keyblader trio is able to summon their keyblade back to their hand when any one of them is disarmed, which happens at least once for each of them? And yet, in the actual trailer, one can see Terra summon his keyblade in a fashion similar to "modern" keybearers. I don't suppose it matters very much, yet I'm still curious.

 

[Smile]

Well, they might not have thought about it in the scripting phase. Also, TAV from the trailers seem to take a while in summoning their Keyblades, at least Terra, and it's not like they had the luxury of time on their hands; MX and DS would pound them (not that they didn't already) the instant they stopped moving.
I think it's a lot more 'didn't' instead of 'couldn't'.

 

[Ordeith]

I think it's a lot more 'didn't' instead of 'couldn't'.

True, considering the fact that Terra and Aqua were being overwhelmed by a maelstrom of keyblades, while Ven was in the process of having his helmet, and his skull, nearly, cracked open, not to mention being frozen and tossed down a cliff face.

 

[Grey]

Xion's Keyblade being said to be fake by Riku aside (since we don't know whether or not he was right though it does raise the probability), we already ran into a fake Keyblade.
The Heart Unlocker which Sora used to turn himself into a Heartless is artificial. It is a Keyblade, yet it is not a proper one.


you're basing this on what, exactly? Should Xion's Keyblade truly be fake, it completely sinks the entire "Keychains = real Keyblade, hence no Keychain = fake Keyblade" argument. TAV could have undeveloped Keyblades; Xion's Keyblade, while having a Keychain, seems to be fake.
You've nothing to base your claim on, with enough probable circumstances to go against it.

I've heard the theory that Terra's, Aqua's, and Ven's Keyblades are man-made (which was inspired by how Terra summoned his Keyblade), but somehow, not necessarily fake. There was an argument for it, but I figured I'd throw that out there.

Wasn't it said that whenever Xion uses her Keyblade, Roxas doesn't? I always thought that meant that Roxas' and Xion's KK were the same, and that they shared it. I could've sworn there was some sort of scan or interview that stated that a while ago...I haven't been following info on Days as much as I have BbS.

Or was it that Roxas never used the KK when Sora did? I can't remember. If someone could clear this up, it'd be helpful.

 

[Smile]

Wasn't it said that whenever Xion uses her Keyblade, Roxas doesn't? I always thought that meant that Roxas' and Xion's KK were the same, and that they shared it. I could've sworn there was some sort of scan or interview that stated that a while ago...I haven't been following info on Days as much as I have BbS.

That was the most common conception for a long while, seeing how whenever Roxas was holding the KK, Xion wasn't, and the same applied in reverse.
Then came about a clip from the game (not cutscene mind) that showed the both of them, at the Underworld, both holding KKs while talking to each other. Hence, Xion has her own Keyblade at one point in the game (not saying she didn't steal Roxas's KK ever, but in the long run, she doesn't need to, and has one of her own)

Or was it that Roxas never used the KK when Sora did?

Nomura referenced Roxas and Sora wielding at the same time as a rare occurrence that has to do with Xehanort's Memories, namely - BBS. Probably the Ven factor which lets them both wield at the same time (CoM time frame), and probably eventually Duel Wield, too.

 

[Inside Job]

First off I would assume that there are no fake keyblades, the keyblade chooses its master, keychains are like hearts it takes on many forms

Xion's keyblade is said to be "fake" by Riku.

It is believed that keyblade masters were able to train other young, determined warriors to use a keyblade, making many keyblade users at the time. But where have they gone? <--- Thats a
question I want to
be answered.

 

[Smile]

It is believed that keyblade masters were able to train other young, determined warriors to use a keyblade

And what, pray-tell, makes people believe that? Terra gave Riku the Keyblade, sure, but he certainly didn't stay around to train him.

 

[Pheonex]

Maybe Riku would've chosen the right path if Terra had stuck around to train him to actually use it.

 

[Smile]

I don't think Terra's the right mentor. It's like having The Emperor train Anakin to be Darth Vader from the get go, instead of have him fall to the Dark Side on his own.

 

[Zeagal]

In regards to the Keyblade - it means the world.

How so, is it just in the power level and appearance?

MX and DS have their own Keyblades, you forget there.
Nomura also stated there are as many Keyblades as there are qualified Hearts. I doubt they're all variations of the KK/IKK and WtD.
In fact, inside those three examples is proof to there being many keyblades. The IKK and KK look alike because they're related. However, the WtD is separate from them and is based on Riku's own personal history. You already have a lack of consistency, which no doubt reflects on the rest.

If this is true then wouldn't there be more wielders out there, and if there aren't would it have something to do with masters not being there? However, the whole you need a master to be a wielder thing doesn't make sense, look at Sora and Riku.

That quote could also refer to Org XIII or something along those lines, you know, seeing how all three games are connected, so Days is as likely as BBS is to be the key to that quote's meaning.

What about the "Lost Two?"

Soul Eater - not a Keyblade, no Keychain.

Soul Eater=weapon Riku created with his heart?

And what, pray-tell, makes people believe that? Terra gave Riku the Keyblade, sure, but he certainly didn't stay around to train him.

What if Terra wanted to, but couldn't due to his heart slipping into Darkness? He could have figured it was best for him to stay away.

 

[Smile]

How so, is it just in the power level and appearance?

Way I see it, it would reflect on your level as a Keyblade Wielder, and we know that's dependent on your strength of Heart. So whether or not you have a Keychain slapped on would either make you a "Master", or less should the Keychain be lacking.

If this is true then wouldn't there be more wielders out there, and if there aren't would it have something to do with masters not being there?

BBS is supposed to explain it. Hence the field of Keyblades in the secret endings.

However, the whole you need a master to be a wielder thing doesn't make sense, look at Sora and Riku.

Which is what I'm saying, though to be precise and petty, they did get their Keyblades originally from Terra, even with the circumstances being unknown.
Terra chose Riku, making him a Wielder, and then Sora got the Keyblade from Riku, making him a Wielder as well.

What about the "Lost Two?"

Any random two members of TAV? XD; with the third person either being 'found' inside Xehanort (Terra), inside Sora (Ven), or Aqua, being out there somewhere, with the other two people being lost inside other people.

Soul Eater=weapon Riku created with his heart?

That's the general notion about it, though Nomura himself has stated in Another Report the Soul Eater's origins are yet to have been revealed.

What if Terra wanted to, but couldn't due to his heart slipping into Darkness? He could have figured it was best for him to stay away.

We won't know for a while then, I'm afraid.

 

[Kingaison98]

I believe that Sora's KK is just a version of the term "Keyblade". Because, when you got other kinds of keyblades, to equip them it says "Keychains", not "Keyblades". I think the Keychains were just ways to access other keyblades. Like there are many Keyblades that aren't accessible as an individual weapon, but as a variation of a weapon. All the keyblades Sora uses have keychains. WtD did too, and so did the fagkey. And they're all different. Possibly the keyblade is one concept and the Keychains are awarded to those with strong enough hearts as upgrades.

 

[Optimus Rhyme]

Soul Eater=weapon Riku created with his heart?

It was created from the darkness in his heart, but it took shape with Malificent's magic.

 

[Zeagal]

Which is what I'm saying, though to be precise and petty, they did get their Keyblades originally from Terra, even with the circumstances being unknown.
Terra chose Riku, making him a Wielder, and then Sora got the Keyblade from Riku, making him a Wielder as well.

Yet they weren't trained thus the they don't have to be in order to wield they just have to be chosen...

Any random two members of TAV? XD; with the third person either being 'found' inside Xehanort (Terra), inside Sora (Ven), or Aqua, being out there somewhere, with the other two people being lost inside other people.

Why is the "Lost Two" believed to be 2 of TAV?

That's the general notion about it, though Nomura himself has stated in Another Report the Soul Eater's origins are yet to have been revealed.

That's what makes it important then.

Something I've been wondering and can't even remember asking before yet have the slightest feeling I have...What gives Terra the authority to "choose" a wielder? Just cause his emblem is gold?

 

[Smile]

I believe that Sora's KK is just a version of the term "Keyblade". Because, when you got other kinds of keyblades, to equip them it says "Keychains", not "Keyblades".

The KK, judging by the IKK, is the basic, standard form of that Keyblade. The fact he received it as such from Riku kind of supports that notion.
It's one form out of many, yes, but it's the one that 'should be', hence why it's also the official one for him.

I think the Keychains were just ways to access other keyblades.

Regardless of the Keychain, Sora's using the same base Keyblade all through the series.

All the keyblades Sora uses have keychains.

Because the base had a Keychain, hence why it could be costumized with other Keychains. It's still one and the same Keyblade.

WtD did too, and so did the fagkey. And they're all different.

Riku's Keychain is based on other things than what Sora's Keychains are, so of course they'd be different.
There's still only two Keyblades in play here, being Sora's (which he can Duel Wield), and Riku's (which he could also Duel Wield, at least as Rikunort)

Possibly the keyblade is one concept and the Keychains are awarded to those with strong enough hearts as upgrades.

The term "upgrade" relates to gameplay mechanics. They have a deeper meaning, hence why they bothered to have Keyblades that lack Keychains. This probably relates to TAV's status as Apprentices as opposed to Riku and Sora who have been ranked from Masters to proper Wielders.

It was created from the darkness in his heart, but it took shape with Malificent's magic.

You're basing this on KHWiki, right? However, if you ask Nomura...

However there is no particular explanation for the Soul Eater’s transfer and occurence

You'll see it was never really explained properly.
Unless someone wants to enlighten us all from a novel paragraph or something.

Yet they weren't trained thus the they don't have to be in order to wield they just have to be chosen...

Their Hearts are "Master level". That's good enough.

Why is the "Lost Two" believed to be 2 of TAV?

My own personal beliefs and preferences.

Something I've been wondering and can't even remember asking before yet have the slightest feeling I have...What gives Terra the authority to "choose" a wielder? Just cause his emblem is gold?

It would appear that for now, the answer is "he could, hence he did."