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What Xemnas was doing in the Chamber of Repose



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This just sort of hit me a little while ago.

I was thinking about the manner in which Yen Sid will have Sora and Riku enter the Realm of Sleep. Odds are it has something to do with... well, sleeping, but I imagine it's some sort of special sleep.

And as that came to mind, it just sort of dawned on me.
Xemnas sleeping in the Chamber of Repose. He was visiting the Realm of Sleep.

Still, that leaves a lot more questions than it does answers. Namely, where exactly he was going in the Realm of Sleep. Well, remember what Xigbar said. "With the Chamber of Repose comes the Chamber of Waking."

So, from that I gather that Xemnas was accessing the Chamber of Waking (and Ven) via the Realm of Sleep. How? Well, here's what we know about the Realm of Sleep:

The “World Submerged in Sleep” is a complex story, but there were worlds other than those that Sora restored in KH1, some that were not submerged in darkness. Like the worlds of the princesses and Dumbo’s, etc. In the end of KH1 it was established that some of those worlds were restored, but not all of them. Those that were neither in light nor in darkness, but those that were submerged in sleep.

(Not sure as to the accuracy of this translation, eg is it saying that the Princesses worlds were NOT submerged in darkness? Because they clearly were. Regardless...)

I don't think there's much doubt that Land of Departure would be one of those worlds submerged in sleep, even with Castle Oblivion still existing. So, he'd be able to go into the Realm of Sleep and visit Ven.

I still can't say how exactly the CoR connects to the CoW. maybe aqua's armor guides him there. idk. bonk you.

actually he was just sniffing the crotch of aqua's armor
 

Darkrider S

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Sooo say your theory is correct.. possibly Theres a chance Sora might Encounter Castle Oblivion in the Realm of sleep? where the MoM is taking place
 

Sephiroth0812

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Not quite Castle Oblivion, as that is in the realm of in-between, but rather the Land of Departure, which IS most likely "submerged" into sleep due to Aqua transforming the world into Castle Oblivion.
She locked it "away into sleep" so to say.

As with the Chamber of Waking, it would really diffuse the "without Aqua no one is able to reach Ven" and make the intended protection for Ven Aqua had envisioned effectively nullified.
It would also throw up the question what Xemnas would actually gain from that...it's just Ven's body lying there comatose, as Ven's damaged heart has found shelter in Sora's (or rather, in Roxas during the time of CoM and Days).
 

Mite

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If Xemnas did use the realm of sleep then he could have possibly overcome the need to use Aqua to find Ven. But since we don't know exactly how the realm of sleep works even if TLoD is there would Ven be there as well since he's already hidden in C.O.? And even if Xemnas found Ven what advantage would he gain? All that's in there is Ven's comatose body, and it's probably not going to be sharing any secrets.
 

Darkrider S

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It would also throw up the question what Xemnas would actually gain from that...it's just Ven's body lying there comatose, as Ven's damaged heart has found shelter in Sora's (or rather, in Roxas during the time of CoM and Days).

^You'd be suprised how what Old men Pedophiles are capable off =P
 

Sephiroth0812

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If Xemnas did use the realm of sleep then he could have possibly overcome the need to use Aqua to find Ven. But since we don't know exactly how the realm of sleep works even if TLoD is there would Ven be there as well since he's already hidden in C.O.? And even if Xemnas found Ven what advantage would he gain? All that's in there is Ven's comatose body, and it's probably not going to be sharing any secrets.

That would work only if one places the assumption that the chamber of Waking is accessible through the realm of sleep, which would effectively undo the actual intention of it being a protective shelter for Ventus completely.
Heck, the whole creation of the chamber by Aqua was done on the premise to hide Ven away so no one could use him again.
The bigger question would be then however the chamber of Repose, which Xemnas curiuosly created to be nearly exactly the same layout as the CoW.

Ven would surely not be in a Land of Departure in the realm of sleep since his parts are already hidden elsewhere, like said, body and soul in C.O. and his severly maimed heart (which should also hold his mind and sense of self) is sleeping inside Sora's heart.

^You'd be suprised how what Old men Pedophiles are capable off =P

Ouch, that was a low blow...but Xemnas isn't MX so the pedophile might not even apply here...;P
 

Darkrider S

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That would work only if one places the assumption that the chamber of Waking is accessible through the realm of sleep, which would effectively undo the actual intention of it being a protective shelter for Ventus completely.
Heck, the whole creation of the chamber by Aqua was done on the premise to hide Ven away so no one could use him again.
The bigger question would be then however the chamber of Repose, which Xemnas curiuosly created to be nearly exactly the same layout as the CoW.

Ven would surely not be in a Land of Departure in the realm of sleep since his parts are already hidden elsewhere, like said, body and soul in C.O. and his severly maimed heart (which should also hold his mind and sense of self) is sleeping inside Sora's heart.



Ouch, that was a low blow...but Xemnas isn't MX so the pedophile might not even apply here...;P

Lol, but on a serious note. You forgot that Terra is still hidden somewhere in the Body of Xemnas, MX, Ansem S.o.D e.t.c ( I may be wrong for the Ansem one) so maybe terras the one searchign for Ven if Xemnas were to gain something by searching for it. Either that or its MX tryna Forge the X-blade again?.. But then Vens heart is in Soras.. Tbh im just taking Honest guesses here =P
 
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As with the Chamber of Waking, it would really diffuse the "without Aqua no one is able to reach Ven" and make the intended protection for Ven Aqua had envisioned effectively nullified.
It would also throw up the question what Xemnas would actually gain from that...it's just Ven's body lying there comatose, as Ven's damaged heart has found shelter in Sora's (or rather, in Roxas during the time of CoM and Days).

No it wouldn't, because he still would not be capable of reaching Ven's physical body.
What he would gain from this is pretty simple- he learns where Ven's body is.

As for the question of how Ven could appear in the Realm of Sleep, I don't think it's as simple as saying that he sleeps in Sora's heart. Yes, physically his heart does. But if that was where he was in the Realm of Sleep, well, gee, Sora would have found him instantly! The Realm of Sleep is a different plane of reality and I'd imagine it operated based on... well, dreams. That is, where one dreams one is, that's where one is in the Realm of Sleep. Think of it as Limbo in Inception terms, where dreams overlap. Ven dreams of Land of Departure, and that's where I believe he is. It's no coincidence. He dreams of the last place his body was. And the dreamer is likely to dream of a place special to them (not surprising that Sora and Riku dream of Destiny Islands first, from what it appears).

So that's it, really. As Ven's heart sleeps in Sora in the physical world, it dreams of Land of Departure and is there in the Realm of Sleep.
I don't think Xemnas would be capable of doing anything with this outside of knowing where to look for Ven.
 

Sephiroth0812

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Lol, but on a serious note. You forgot that Terra is still hidden somewhere in the Body of Xemnas, MX, Ansem S.o.D e.t.c ( I may be wrong for the Ansem one) so maybe terras the one searchign for Ven if Xemnas were to gain something by searching for it. Either that or its MX tryna Forge the X-blade again?.. But then Vens heart is in Soras.. Tbh im just taking Honest guesses here =P

Well, it is said that Xemnas had some of Terra's memories so his motivation for searching for Ventus might have an influence on this, although Xehanort also has plenty of reasons for it, not because to directly forge the X-blade again but because Ven is essentially still "material" for it and depending on how much Xemnas has of MX, he can put two and two together about where Ven's heart is by just friggin' look at Roxas.
Ventus already been broken would also not being a hindrance to MX since he's less like to put up resistance that way...and the "Can you spare a heart?" from the KH II Final battle when trapping Sora can also point in the direction that Xemnas knew of the residence of Ven's heart (Roxas was by then fused into Sora).

However, it being actually Terra's will in any form I would doubt since in Xemnas there's obviously also Xehanort-influence and Terra wouldn't want to risk putting Ven into reach of Xehanort again.

No it wouldn't, because he still would not be capable of reaching Ven's physical body.
What he would gain from this is pretty simple- he learns where Ven's body is.

As for the question of how Ven could appear in the Realm of Sleep, I don't think it's as simple as saying that he sleeps in Sora's heart. Yes, physically his heart does. But if that was where he was in the Realm of Sleep, well, gee, Sora would have found him instantly! The Realm of Sleep is a different plane of reality and I'd imagine it operated based on... well, dreams. That is, where one dreams one is, that's where one is in the Realm of Sleep. Think of it as Limbo in Inception terms, where dreams overlap. Ven dreams of Land of Departure, and that's where I believe he is. It's no coincidence. He dreams of the last place his body was. And the dreamer is likely to dream of a place special to them (not surprising that Sora and Riku dream of Destiny Islands first, from what it appears).

So that's it, really. As Ven's heart sleeps in Sora in the physical world, it dreams of Land of Departure and is there in the Realm of Sleep.
I don't think Xemnas would be capable of doing anything with this outside of knowing where to look for Ven.

Would make sense in a way, however, it strikes one a bit odd since in KH 2 FM in the extra scenes Xigbar seemed already to know that the chamber of waking holds the other "friend", I was more on the impression that it has to do something with Aqua's armor.

So, you mean like a sort of dream self, that wanders around this realm while your actual mind/consciousness (and heart) is sleeping/unconscious.
The last place Ven knows where his body was is keyblade graveyard or mysterious tower though, after that he was already comatose only struggling with his catastrophical injured heart, only managing to get a last straw of strength going to show Aqua where he wishes to be.
Except...if he somehow felt/knew that Aqua indeed took him there and his heart only succumbed fully to its wounds when Aqua fell into the RoD and Sora reached out for him.
Yeah, the "dreaming of a place special to you" is very convienent also considering Ven's somewhat clingy personality and the LoD basically the source of his most cherished memories.

Hmm...sounds definitely plausible...I could imagine Ven freaking out though seeing Xemnas..as he has the dreaded Xehanort-eyes ;P.
Going by this premise, we might even see anyone of the suffering people inside that realm (except Aqua and Ansem the Wise), especially those who already disappeared and have nothing left but their minds, memories and...tada: Dreams. One can bet that incomplete beings like i.e. Naminé would have wishes and dreams as well and those could be personified inside the Realm of Sleep.

It would also make sense then if Sora and Riku really meet Ansem SoD and Xemnas inside there...
 
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Would make sense in a way, however, it strikes one a bit odd since in KH 2 FM in the extra scenes Xigbar seemed already to know that the chamber of waking holds the other "friend", I was more on the impression that it has to do something with Aqua's armor.

I sort of inferred that Xigbar acquired that information from overhearing Xemnas' "conversations."


So, you mean like a sort of dream self, that wanders around this realm while your actual mind/consciousness (and heart) is sleeping/unconscious.
The last place Ven knows where his body was is keyblade graveyard or mysterious tower though, after that he was already comatose only struggling with his catastrophical injured heart, only managing to get a last straw of strength going to show Aqua where he wishes to be.
Except...if he somehow felt/knew that Aqua indeed took him there and his heart only succumbed fully to its wounds when Aqua fell into the RoD and Sora reached out for him.
Yeah, the "dreaming of a place special to you" is very convienent also considering Ven's somewhat clingy personality and the LoD basically the source of his most cherished memories.

Hmm...sounds definitely plausible...I could imagine Ven freaking out though seeing Xemnas..as he has the dreaded Xehanort-eyes ;P.
Going by this premise, we might even see anyone of the suffering people inside that realm (except Aqua and Ansem the Wise), especially those who already disappeared and have nothing left but their minds, memories and...tada: Dreams. One can bet that incomplete beings like i.e. Naminé would have wishes and dreams as well and those could be personified inside the Realm of Sleep.

It would also make sense then if Sora and Riku really meet Ansem SoD and Xemnas inside there...

Yeah, I mean, let's put it this way, I doubt Sora and Riku's physical bodies are going into the Realm of Sleep (perhaps, but I doubt it, especially considering that then they would literally be transforming into their younger selves). And yet they are free to roam about there. So even though they go to, say, Destiny Island, it's not like that necessarily corresponds to their physical location in the real world.

I think they are free to roam about these dream worlds because they are not "sleeping" in the sense that they're "dead," whereas others are anchored to certain important locations based on their lives in a purgatory of sorts.

I've actually considered the idea of the BbS secret ending being a literal display of the Realm of Sleep (eg Namine/Roxas/Axel/Xion are in a dream version of Twilight Town), though that does open a whole other can of worms, especially with Terra at the Land of Departure.
 

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So Terra got a hold of Xemnas, so to speak, and decided to take a visit to see his ol' pal Ventus?
 

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Wanna add my 2 cents.

Xemnas is a being (or... not, you know) other than Xehanort. He's the recollection of both MX and Terra, so to speak, so it wouldn't be weird at all that he tried to communicate with Ventus, since he's part of his memories, and the use of this Dream World to get to him seems a fair alternative, given Ven's 10 year straight nap.
 

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then what would the two talk about exactly
Cupcakes and pie?
Personally i don't see anything wrong with thinking that the end of BBS was a literal scene. I mean Xemnas had Terra's memorys (and heart?) and when he goes to "sleep" in the CoS he sees himself as Terra. All he(Terra) really wanted to do was see his friends again, so he goes into this Realm of Sleep to converse with an old lost friend and try to find out where he is. The problem is though that Ven doesn't even know where he is. He doesn't know about Castle Oblivion, much less how to navigate through that mess of a place.
 
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Mirby

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I've actually considered the idea of the BbS secret ending being a literal display of the Realm of Sleep (eg Namine/Roxas/Axel/Xion are in a dream version of Twilight Town), though that does open a whole other can of worms, especially with Terra at the Land of Departure.

Maybe Terra's heart is sleeping too? I mean, in Blank Points, MX does mention he has all the time in the world to settle the "property dispute" as he puts it. Mayhaps when Xemnas (and Ansem, SoD) was formed, Terra's heart was put to sleep in the process... it would make sense, especially considering him and Ven dreaming of their home. Or maybe it's just Ven dreaming up Terra...

That also would make sense with the four in Twilight Town. I think you just might be onto something, Grass.

Also, if you think about the phrasing in the video (All the pieces lie where they fell), I think you can get something from that. Xion fell in Twilight Town, and Axel fell in the portal from there to TWTNW. Roxas technically didn't fall (neither did Namine), but they'll have strong memories and a strong attachment to the place. Same with Terra and Ven. Their hearts lie with their fallen home.

Of course, this is all just speculation and I could be completely wrong. XD
 

JustDarkMemories

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Does that mean Sora and Riku could cross paths with Terra in the RoS? Also, the point of the MoM might be that they have to wake up sleeping worlds...
Well, yes, and no. Since Sora "saved the world(s)" again, the two have to go somewhere darkness "infected" again to prove their Mark. That would be the RoS. The worlds being restored back to the RoL is just a fortunate... side effect.
 

kupo1121

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Maybe I missed something or maybe I'm not picking it up, but basically everyone here pretty much thinks that Castle Oblivion lies in the RoS? If that is the case, how did the Org. like Axel, Larxene, etc. and Sora and co. get there???
 

Love Machine

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Maybe I missed something or maybe I'm not picking it up, but basically everyone here pretty much thinks that Castle Oblivion lies in the RoS? If that is the case, how did the Org. like Axel, Larxene, etc. and Sora and co. get there???

sleeping. they just ran down a path in the crossroads and somehow got there, i think
 

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sleeping. they just ran down a path in the crossroads and somehow got there, i think

This makes alot of sense. They were sleeping and then ended up going to Oblivion seemingly out of nowhere. Was it ever implied that Castle Oblivion lies in the Realm In-Between?

If not, taking in perspective that the Land of Departure was a RoL World destroyed not by the Heartless but by MX's influence directly, Castle Oblivion could have been created then "fallen into sleep", since there was nothing holding it in the RoL any longer.

And I'm sticking with Grass's theory that the revealed Tormented at the end of BbSFM are in the Realm of Sleep...hence why they uttered Sora, since dreams are technically memories created by self, and they would retain their experiences from the RoL.

EDIT: And going on that note, if dreams are based off of memories, memories could be the driving power behind the Realm of Sleep, hence Castle Oblivion's power relying on memories...
 
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