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Will we finally get to face Apprentice Xehanort



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RonaldPoe

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This thread's actually about both speculation and battle music. There are quite a few possibilities for A-Nort's fighting style but I think he'd be most similar to Ansem in Re:Mind crossed with Xemnas, Terranort, Vexen (less likely but he's a scientist and worked with him), and even vaguely Oogie Boogie (he could rely on technology in the fight). Oogie Boogie and A-Nort are completely unrelated but their fights could be more similar than you'd think. Of course the rhythm game style means he could have a more basic fighting style and/or not need a new one.

Some of the tracks you listed, Clue.Less, probably will be cut like "Desire for All That is Lost", "A Link to the Future", the Level 3 Gummi theme, ect. Those ones are too unrelated and wouldn't make much sense. I would've never thought of using"Missing You" (Namine's theme would be quite appropriate here) or "Treasured Memories" but they make too much sense to leave out. I was also thinking of including the Radiant Garden themes from BBS and "Dark Clones" (the Xehanort Replica theme from KH3) among others. The latter only because it's a great version of Destati (much more impressive than the 2 battle themes that follow it). It's more of a general A-Nort track but will reference Kairi too. Thanks for the help.

I might add some non-KH tracks to the list as inspirations (as in not incorporated directly but still influencing the piece). Any tracks (songs or score) that remind you of Apprentice Xehanort. Just curious and think it'd help.

I'm currently working on an Ambient theme (that's one of my specialties) for Vexen because he's never had his own battle theme (he shares it with the others at Castle Oblivion) or character theme (I guess his role is too minor). I'm mostly incorporating only 4 to 5 main pieces into the my pieces/arrangements and using the rest for inspiration so it doesn't get too bloated. Also the Vexen theme is mostly "The 13th Struggle" (his original boss theme) and "Scherzo De Notte" (his hometown's battle theme). It'll have a big role in my future A-Nort battle theme as a part of the arrangement and/or inspiration. Sorry for the long post but I just thought you'd like to know my plans beforehand (the track might take a while before any demos are posted).
 

Xagzan

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This thread's actually about both speculation and battle music. There are quite a few possibilities for A-Nort's fighting style but I think he'd be most similar to Ansem in Re:Mind crossed with Xemnas, Terranort, Vexen (less likely but he's a scientist and worked with him), and even vaguely Oogie Boogie (he could rely on technology in the fight). Oogie Boogie and A-Nort are completely unrelated but their fights could be more similar than you'd think. Of course the rhythm game style means he could have a more basic fighting style and/or not need a new one.

Some of the tracks you listed, Clue.Less, probably will be cut like "Desire for All That is Lost", "A Link to the Future", the Level 3 Gummi theme, ect. Those ones are too unrelated and wouldn't make much sense. I would've never thought of using"Missing You" (Namine's theme would be quite appropriate here) or "Treasured Memories" but they make too much sense to leave out. I was also thinking of including the Radiant Garden themes from BBS and "Dark Clones" (the Xehanort Replica theme from KH3)
Oh god please no, not that one. Sorry I just can't with Ishimoto's work on this series 😅 Every time I open my ears, he lets me down.

The latter only because it's a great version of Destati (much more impressive than the 2 battle themes that follow it).
Are you referring to the Armored and Final Xehanort tracks? Because if you are, I should mention that the latter is mostly just the previous 2 mashed together, because of course, Ishimoto.

Also why are we assuming a fight with his Apprentice look wouldn't just be similar to all the other Terranort fights?
 

KeybladeLordSora

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I mean, due to it likely being an illusion based on Kairi's memory she might see more Terranort-like atuff, but if it goes the fill on Apprenticenort route...he'd kinda have nothing to do since Apprenticenort kinda doesn't remember how to do anything combat related...or anything Xehanorty until he goes stabby stabby on everybody and unlocks the door to RG's heart.
 

RonaldPoe

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I think Ishimoto is a good composer but Yoko Shimomura is a genius and leagues above him. I thinkat's why his tracks aren't as great as Yoko's. Here's my opinions on the last 3 boss themes of KH3. This may get a little controversial.

I think "Dark Clones" (the Xehanort Replica theme) is easily the strongest of the 3 final boss themes. It might not be as great as "Darkness of the Unknown" (Xemnas' iconic theme) and "Obscuritas Di Xehanort" (a wonderful blend/medley of Ansem, Xemnas, and Young Xehanort's themes and a highlight of the KH3 soundtrack). However it's still an epic yet distinct version of "Destati" that gets me pumped and fits the boss fight perfectly. Here's a link to the track I'm referring to.

Armored Xehanort has an awesome and unique design but his theme is easily the weakest of the 3. It should've been a powerful tribute to all the Xehanort themes of the past. Instead we get some B-Movie horror music built around psycho strings. I've heard it does incorporate "Rage Awakened" but that's mostly a Terra theme. You know it's bad when "Face My Fears" (the Utada and Skrillex song from the opening) sounds and fits the fight leagues better. I'm so disappointed by it that I'm going to create my own Armored Xehanort theme myself (it will incorporate actual Xehanort themes for one) once I improve a lot.

The final Xehanort theme has been discussed a lot but here's my 2 cents. . The few tracks it does incorporate ("Destati", "Rage Awakened", and "Guardando Nel Buio") have already been mixed better in Birth by Sleep. It tries to be grandiose but ends up being a cheap rehash of "Dismiss" (same tracks involved) except composed by Ishimoto. I'd say it should have built and improved on the previous 2 tracks ("Dark Clones" and an alternate Armored Xehanort theme). It's an okay composition but not anywhere near the level of previous final boss themes.

I'm stil going to make an A-Nort theme but I've got another KH musical project first. Also I'm curious what songs or scores outside of KH you guys think would fit A-Nort?
 

Xagzan

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I think Ishimoto is a good composer but Yoko Shimomura is a genius and leagues above him. I thinkat's why his tracks aren't as great as Yoko's. Here's my opinions on the last 3 boss themes of KH3. This may get a little controversial.

I think "Dark Clones" (the Xehanort Replica theme) is easily the strongest of the 3 final boss themes. It might not be as great as "Darkness of the Unknown" (Xemnas' iconic theme) and "Obscuritas Di Xehanort" (a wonderful blend/medley of Ansem, Xemnas, and Young Xehanort's themes and a highlight of the KH3 soundtrack). However it's still an epic yet distinct version of "Destati" that gets me pumped and fits the boss fight perfectly. Here's a link to the track I'm referring to.

Armored Xehanort has an awesome and unique design but his theme is easily the weakest of the 3. It should've been a powerful tribute to all the Xehanort themes of the past. Instead we get some B-Movie horror music built around psycho strings. I've heard it does incorporate "Rage Awakened" but that's mostly a Terra theme. You know it's bad when "Face My Fears" (the Utada and Skrillex song from the opening) sounds and fits the fight leagues better. I'm so disappointed by it that I'm going to create my own Armored Xehanort theme myself (it will incorporate actual Xehanort themes for one) once I improve a lot.

The final Xehanort theme has been discussed a lot but here's my 2 cents. . The few tracks it does incorporate ("Destati", "Rage Awakened", and "Guardando Nel Buio") have already been mixed better in Birth by Sleep. It tries to be grandiose but ends up being a cheap rehash of "Dismiss" (same tracks involved) except composed by Ishimoto. I'd say it should have built and improved on the previous 2 tracks ("Dark Clones" and an alternate Armored Xehanort theme). It's an okay composition but not anywhere near the level of previous final boss themes.

I'm stil going to make an A-Nort theme but I've got another KH musical project first. Also I'm curious what songs or scores outside of KH you guys think would fit A-Nort?
Well shoot you don't have to tell me, I'm with you on all that lol. Been saying it ad nauseum since the game came out. Although I only just recently realized (since I hadn't listened to them much at all) that the Key to All was mostly a lazy copy/paste of the previous 2 themes. And no, Rage Awakened made no sense there.

Saying the Replica theme was the strongest of the 3, though...pretty low bar imo :p

Ironically I thought those "b-movie" strings were superb when they played in the ReMind cutscene when the replicas appear before the guardians. Using full orchestration and creating a dramatic cinematic feel. Dunno whether it was Shimomura or Kawamori or someone else behind the arrangement.

Anyway, I gave a rundown a while back of how I imagine a final Xehanort theme should've been in some other topic, what motives it could have incorporated, maybe I'll try to find it.
 

Dast

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Thinking about the trailer, I don't think it's even certain that we will get any playable fight between Kairi and the assumed Apprentice Xehanort. We've seen a cutscene of Kairi running to attack the hooded figure with her Keyblade but there have been times in the series where something like that hasn't led to a playable battle. I could see something else happening, e.g. Kairi attacks but A-Nort just teleports to dodge it and reappears to say some mysterious stutf, rather than to fight her. (It's my view that the game will reveal something about Apprentice Xehanort's research that will link to future games so I can see the apparitions role being to talk and not fight, at least).
 

RonaldPoe

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I never said the Armored Xehanort theme was a terrible composition or that those strings couldn't work in a different context. Just that it was very unfitting and not up to par with KH standards. If the same track were a mid-game boss theme in a Resident Evil (yes I like both those games and the movies) game, it might've worked fine.
Maybe the final Xehanort theme should've been a mixture of "Dark Clones" and an alternate Armored Xehanort theme but in a melancholy style similar to the last stage of "Darkness of the Unknown". That was his last stand after all.

Anyway I'm still hoping for an A-Nort/Apprentice Xehanort theme and fight in Melody of Memory. I looked up Xagazan's post and he's right about including more obscure/underrated themes (at least as inspirations). I'm thinking Xehanort's Theme/"Xehanort the Early Years", "Black Powder" (boss theme that's related to Xehanort and Terra), and maybe "Beyond The Door" (Theme from KH1 that once played for Ansem) along with more iconic theme. Those three are rarely incorporated into arrangements and never together. I want the Apprentice Xehanort theme to play tribute to previous Xehanort themes while fitting the character.
Here's Xangan's post.

 

the red monster

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Thinking about the trailer, I don't think it's even certain that we will get any playable fight between Kairi and the assumed Apprentice Xehanort. We've seen a cutscene of Kairi running to attack the hooded figure with her Keyblade but there have been times in the series where something like that hasn't led to a playable battle. I could see something else happening, e.g. Kairi attacks but A-Nort just teleports to dodge it and reappears to say some mysterious stutf, rather than to fight her. (It's my view that the game will reveal something about Apprentice Xehanort's research that will link to future games so I can see the apparitions role being to talk and not fight, at least).
Yep pretty much what i think will happen
 

Xagzan

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I never said the Armored Xehanort theme was a terrible composition or that those strings couldn't work in a different context. Just that it was very unfitting and not up to par with KH standards. If the same track were a mid-game boss theme in a Resident Evil (yes I like both those games and the movies) game, it might've worked fine.
Maybe the final Xehanort theme should've been a mixture of "Dark Clones" and an alternate Armored Xehanort theme but in a melancholy style similar to the last stage of "Darkness of the Unknown". That was his last stand after all.

Anyway I'm still hoping for an A-Nort/Apprentice Xehanort theme and fight in Melody of Memory. I looked up Xagazan's post and he's right about including more obscure/underrated themes (at least as inspirations). I'm thinking Xehanort's Theme/"Xehanort the Early Years", "Black Powder" (boss theme that's related to Xehanort and Terra), and maybe "Beyond The Door" (Theme from KH1 that once played for Ansem) along with more iconic theme. Those three are rarely incorporated into arrangements and never together. I want the Apprentice Xehanort theme to play tribute to previous Xehanort themes while fitting the character.
Here's Xangan's post.

Yeah that's the one. Back then I had pretty much the whole track arranged in my head, though now I've forgotten a lot of what I specifically imagined lol. If I had your skills I would've done something with it. But I do remember thinking it would be cool to take themes that weren't necessarily battle music, but still thematically relevant, and kick em into a higher gear (Key of Darkness/Xehanort's theme was really well suited for that, I found).

I don't know if this game is going to have an Apprentice fight, but those themes would still be appropriate basically. Although I'd suspect it'd just be another arrangement of Dismiss, though it wouldn't make much sense.
 

RonaldPoe

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I listened to "Key of Darkness" and it's a great atmsopheric theme. Though I'm not sure if it's more fitting for Master Xehanort or Vanitas. I would include it in an Armored or Final Xehanort theme but not an A-Nort theme. Still I agree that including non-combat music is a great idea and might even be important for these themes. However I think "Dismiss" should be a major part of A-Nort's theme. Why wouldn't it make much sense?

I'm not actually that great of a musician but I think make up for it in passion. The A-Nort theme might take a little while but it should be decent. I'm hoping for a boss fight but we might get a cutscene with little to no fighting.

I might add some non-KH tracks to the list as inspirations (as in not incorporated directly but still influencing the piece). Any tracks (songs or score) that remind you of Apprentice Xehanort. Just curious and think it'd help. My example would be "Weird Science" by Oingo Boingo because it's classic mad scientist music.
 

SweetYetSalty

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All of this is going to waste if the hooded figure isn't A-Nort. I've seen Xigbar's name also being thrown around along with Master of Masters. If it wasn't for the build I would thrown in future Kairi as a candidate. She blames herself for this whole mess. But that is clearly a man's build so no-go.
 

Cumguardian69

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What if future Kairi bulked up and stopped being the dainty weak pos plot device she has been portrayed as oui Ellie from TLOU? /S
 

RonaldPoe

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I know the hooded figure could be the Master of Masters or Luxu. However A-Nort still appears in the trailer so this isn't for waste. I'm hoping he's a boss but that might not be the case. Either way, I'm still going to write this theme.
 

SweetYetSalty

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I know the hooded figure could be the Master of Masters or Luxu. However A-Nort still appears in the trailer so this isn't for waste. I'm hoping he's a boss but that might not be the case. Either way, I'm still going to write this theme.
I hope it is A-Nort. He would fit this theme far better then Master of Masters and Luxu here.
 

MATGSY

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They'd have to pull some BS retcon to make MoM the mastermind behind Kairi's exile. But since this is KH, they will.
 

Xagzan

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I listened to "Key of Darkness" and it's a great atmsopheric theme. Though I'm not sure if it's more fitting for Master Xehanort or Vanitas. I would include it in an Armored or Final Xehanort theme but not an A-Nort theme. Still I agree that including non-combat music is a great idea and might even be important for these themes. However I think "Dismiss" should be a major part of A-Nort's theme. Why wouldn't it make much sense?
Oh cause I was just thinking how it's half Terra's theme. And yes we're talking about Terranort but it's still kind of irrelevant here. At that point in his life, Terra was as submerged and silent in Xehanort as he ever was, and presumably has no bearing on any confrontation Kairi would have with him.
 
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