Xehanort's many forms... (for those that are confused about what's going on)

[Sephiroth0812]

I'm not too sure about that. It seems more like XH just passed on the ability.

Having the ability alone is not enough, just like having the ability to wield a Keyblade alone is not enough if you haven't got a Keyblade chosing the person in question.

It's the same with the time travel-ability. You may have the ability to do so, but as long as you have a physical vessel (aka your body and soul) you are bound by your existence in the current time. Young Xehanort explained that in order to cross time you need to become an existence of only the heart. The moment Ansem SoD entered Riku's body he also lost all time travel possibilities.

As for Sora being able to, actually no. It seems that the widespread conviction we had that Sora was just a walking heart isn't necessary true after all and Kairi's power may have really given him a body, if I interpret the words of Ansem the Wise in the ending correctly:

Ansem the Wise: Sora is unique; even though he returned to his own body, he allowed his Nobody to exist as it was. That is the strength of the thoughts of the people connected to his heart, the strength of his heart's connections. I dare say that even if he were to lose that heart, those he is connected to could, with just those vanished hearts and existences, bring it back.

Going by that, Sora and Roxas co-existing was apparently also partly because Sora subconsciously allowed it to be that way.

 

[billyzanesucks]

^ That's what I had thought before. You're probably right, but I'm still confused as to how they have physical forms. Are they possessing people?

 

[JustSnilloc]

@Sephy, I think you've misinterpreted what Ansem the Wise said... He says

Ansem the Wise: Sora is unique; even though he returned to his own body, he allowed his Nobody to exist as it was. That is the strength of the thoughts of the people connected to his heart, the strength of his heart's connections. I dare say that even if he were to lose that heart, those he is connected to could, with just those vanished hearts and existences, bring it back.

Given the context that Ansem is referring to the time when Sora was given back his "Body" by Kairi's powers, the statement sounds awkward, Sora wasn't even close enough to Roxas to have had an effect like wiping his existence out by continuing his own existence... However, under the criteria that when Sora and Roxas became one (beginning of KH2) it makes a lot more sense

^ That's what I had thought before. You're probably right, but I'm still confused as to how they have physical forms. Are they possessing people?

The Xehanorts? They have the same physical forms that they had in the past... They've just been taken from one point in time and placed into another

 

[billyzanesucks]

The Xehanorts? They have the same physical forms that they had in the past... They've just been taken from one point in time and placed into another

Yet time-travel requires that one give up their body...

 

[KH-x-3]

Oh my god my mind just got blown.

So let me guess this straight.

YMX gave up his body and soul in order to become an existence only of his heart. By doing this, he was able to time travel. Now, in theory, would this not have yielded a Nobody? A first Xehanort nobody?

And so how did YMX reclaim his body and soul in order to return to the past in BBS and MX?

So then when MX took over Terra's body, he again left his body and soul behind. Would this give rebirth to the same Nobody as before or would it create a completely different being? So then we have Terranort.

Terranort is an amalgamation of at least 2 hearts, possibly 3 (Eraqus, which also brings up the subject of where did his body and soul go - another nobody?). When terranort split into Xemnas and AnsemSOD supposedly all 2 or 3 hearts went into ASoD and Xemnas developed his own 'heart'. So then when they remerged, Terranort was back. Only possibly with Terra's, Eraqus's and Xemnas's hearts instead of MX's. So then Terra was still controlled with Xemnas's heart and became "NeoTerranort"??? So far I have listed possibly YMX, YMX Nodody, MX, MX Nobody, Ansem SoD, Xemnas, Terranort, and NeoTerranort. Adding Braig and Isa makes 10 incarnations if any of what I just said makes any sense at all.

Okay my mind broke down now so continue the discussion.

 

[billyzanesucks]

^ Having a Nobody supposedly requires that the heart is consumed by darkness.

 

[KH-x-3]

That I'd forgotten about. So aside from my crazy first YMX Nobody talk, i think I'm caught up.

 

[MasterZeR0]

Yet time-travel requires that one give up their body...

I think it's that YX is the one actually executing the travel, but is bringing along each past self one at a time, as "guests".

 

[Crystal]

Hmm..if YMX give up his own body and soul for time travel, why is he still can exist as a physical form ?

 

[MasterZeR0]

Hmm..if YMX give up his own body and soul for time travel, why is he still can exist as a physical form ?

Could be a "walking heart", as Sora was said to be for a while.

 

[Crystal]

Could be a "walking heart", as Sora was said to be for a while.

So, there will be another YMX's Nobody? xD

 

[Seighart]

So, there will be another YMX's Nobody? xD

No, i do believe YMX doesn't have a nobody or a heartless. He just gave up his body and was just a heart floatin around. What confuses me, is that he has a physical form. Im not sure how the "walking heart" process occurs, but speculation gave rise to YMX being one of these and is generally accepted.

 

[Hillboy]

So, there will be another YMX's Nobody? xD

No he gave up his body, he didn't forfiet his heart to darkness

 

[JustSnilloc]

I think it's that YX is the one actually executing the travel, but is bringing along each past self one at a time, as "guests".

Exactly, [see explanation below]

Yet time-travel requires that one give up their body...

Alright, so currently the "New" Organization only has (as far as we know) one person with the ability to time travel. That one person is YMX, since he can travel through time he can pick up the other Xehanort's without them needing to "cast aside" their bodies

Hmm..if YMX give up his own body and soul for time travel, why is he still can exist as a physical form ?

Could be a "walking heart", as Sora was said to be for a while.

Correct

PPS's... PPS's (or Projected Physical Shells) are what the heart creates when it lacks a body. Heartless create these out of darkness (given that the heart is drowned in it), Sora's was created out of light (because of Kairi's princess powers), and others like Riku, Kairi, Vanitas, and YMX's were probably created from pure strength of heart

Long story short: The strong heart (or heartless) creates a pseudo body when lacking an actual physical one

No, i do believe YMX doesn't have a nobody or a heartless. He just gave up his body and was just a heart floatin around. What confuses me, is that he has a physical form. Im not sure how the "walking heart" process occurs, but speculation gave rise to YMX being one of these and is generally accepted.

Alright, so I explained the "walking heart" process. YMX became one because he cast aside his body. Obviously he wouldn't have a heartless (since he is the heart) but the Nobody is questionable- according to the theory in my sig it should work, but idk if it could or not

 

[8298906]

I think it's that YX is the one actually executing the travel, but is bringing along each past self one at a time, as "guests".

And if he's only moving forward in time let's think of the ones he brought and presented (Heart)Vanitus, Ansem SoD, and Xemnas. Braig and Isa are from the present. So what others he could of brought chronologically between (Heart)Vanitus, Ansem SoD, and Xemnas.

 

[JustSnilloc]

And if he's only moving forward in time let's think of the ones he brought and presented (Heart)Vanitus, Ansem SoD, and Xemnas. Braig and Isa are from the present. So what others he could of brought chronologically between (Heart)Vanitus, Ansem SoD, and Xemnas.

Riku Replica
Rikunort (while his and Xehanort's hearts were inside)
Ven-Van fusion (the one with the X-Blade, probably wouldn't still have it, but...)

a couple of the top of my head... Riku Replica doesn't have a 'nortified heart though

 

[billyzanesucks]

I had considered the "walking heart" thing, but Seph's quote made me question it. I was probably just thinking into it too much.

 

[Crystal]

No he gave up his body, he didn't forfiet his heart to darkness

Why is he having yellow eyes if he didn't accept darkness?

Correct

PPS's... PPS's (or Projected Physical Shells) are what the heart creates when it lacks a body. Heartless create these out of darkness (given that the heart is drowned in it), Sora's was created out of light (because of Kairi's princess powers), and others like Riku, Kairi, Vanitas, and YMX's were probably created from pure strength of heart

Long story short: The strong heart (or heartless) creates a pseudo body when lacking an actual physical one

I'm agree with you. Is it just like Xehanort having a strong heart, which create a strong Heartless and strong Nobody?

 

[Hillboy]

Why is he having yellow eyes if he didn't accept darkness

Yellow eyes have nothing to do with darkness, it means a strong connection to Xehanort (or as we know now that you have a piece of MX's heart inside you you) and considering that is YMX he has the same heart as MX

 

[JustSnilloc]

Why is he having yellow eyes if he didn't accept darkness?

Hillboy pretty much got this one, pretty much Nomura said what Hillboy said in an interview once

Yellow eyes have nothing to do with darkness, it means a strong connection to Xehanort (or as we know now that you have a piece of MX's heart inside you you) and considering that is YMX he has the same heart as MX

Basically, Yellow eyes show a strong connection to Xehanort, and YMX is Xehanort so.....

I'm agree with you. Is it just like Xehanort having a strong heart, which create a strong Heartless and strong Nobody?

Not quite... You see the strong heart will do those things, but that's not quite what happens with YMX (or most of the others)

With YMX, he cast aside his body leaving only his heart. That heart of his (containing all of who he is and being extremely strong) created a PPS of who he was before casting aside his real body. It did this because the heart is extremely vulnerable without a body (pseudo or real)...

With Riku, he was cast from his body by Ansem, Seeker of Darkness. We see in the FM that he creates a PPS while in the RoD (before Ansem is defeated and he gets his body back)

With Vanitas, he was stripped from his original self (Ventus when he had a normal heart) and from that point forward Vanitas existed only of a heart... Thus his heart (wanting to continue existing) created a PPS so that he may live on

With Kairi, something happened (idk) and she was separated from her body. We see her PPS standing in front of DI's Keyhole, and then fading into Sora...


Make more since now? I thought maybe some examples might help, let me know