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Abortion - Pro life or pro choice?



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MomentoMori

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No child can survive unassisted.
That is like saying I will spare the life of a child if it can lay golden eggs...

She means without artificial help (heart/lung machines, breathing machines, etc).

I am saying you are having a loaded question. Your answers were not any of my views.

Because you keep flip flopping back and forth. The situations you come up with are stupid and impractical.
 

Goldpanner

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you said:
you havnt said you dont approve of late term abortions so, to me, you are accepting them.
i.e. you haven't said you don't so i assume you do

krexia said:
I don't approve of late-term abortions unless the mother's life is at risk.
i.e. so you don't have to assume: I don't

you said:
So, changing your position here?
i.e. my assumption was wrong, which means you changed your position

???

No child can survive unassisted.
That is like saying I will spare the life of a child if it can lay golden eggs...

Except there's a difference between
+survive by being biologically hooked up to another human
+survive through the attention of another human/s
Which you clearly don't understand.

Here _EX, look after this sick person.
Here _EX, sew your intestines to this sick person's digestive tract and be a living life support machine
 

Wehrmacht

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So, changing your position here?

I don't think she ever said she was in favor of late-term abortions. Saying that you're "pro-choice" isn't equivalent to saying you approve of abortion at all times.
 

_EX

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She means without artificial help (heart/lung machines, breathing machines, etc).
wouldve been nice if she said that the first time



Because you keep flip flopping back and forth. The situations you come up with are stupid and impractical.
Not really.
The question was this "If a person is responsible for a situation, that person [is/is not] responsible for all consequences of that situation."
That isnt a specific enough question. Someone may be responsible for the consequences of their actions, but not neccessarily of the situation (other people contribute to a situation too, which wasnt specified but still possible. They could be responsible for some of the consequences too). If a woman puts herself at risk of rape, she isnt responsible for the rapist going to jail and getting beaten to death in a shower, for example, though that is a consequence of the situation the woman is partly responsible for being in.
i.e. you haven't said you don't so i assume you do
I said I disagree with abortion, except in situations like rape and if the child is threatening the mother's life.
So no, I dont agree with late term abortions, seeing as they come under "abortions"
Seriously... That would be obvious.
Others (krexia) have said they agree with abortion, which late term aboritons are a part of. If you dont specify, I cant help but assume you do.
If I say "I like dogs", you would assume I like dogs. But if you were to find out that I only like one breed of dog, that would mean that I was a bit misleading.


i.e. so you don't have to assume: I don't
Amazing...



Except there's a difference between
+survive by being biologically hooked up to another human
+survive through the attention of another human/s
Which you clearly don't understand.

Oh, I forgot how she said those differences in her post. Silly me, not reading things that arnt there. How inconsiderate of me.

Here _EX, look after this sick person.
Here _EX, sew your intestines to this sick person's digestive tract and be a living life support machine

Krexia said "survive unassisted." Both, children and premature children, require assistance, some more than others, but assistance none the less. If she meant to say all that extra stuff, she shouldve said it. I dont have to go any further into what she is saying that what she directly says. I am not going to read her mind.

If I said, "rape is cool" and you were all like "so you think woman getting raped at a party is cool?" and I said "No, idiot, I meant to say I think rape is cool if it were hitler getting raped by some large, violent man because I hate hitler. Man, cant you read! You must be trolling!" you would feel pretty wronged. So, go have a cry somewhere else because you cant blame me for what Krexia didnt specify.



I don't think she ever said she was in favor of late-term abortions. Saying that you're "pro-choice" isn't equivalent to saying you approve of abortion at all times.
No, but one can only assume.
What should we draw from someone saying they are pro-choice? that they dont actually approve of any form of abortion?
 

Goldpanner

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If a woman puts herself at risk of rape, she isnt responsible for the rapist going to jail and getting beaten to death in a shower, for example, though that is a consequence of the situation the woman is partly responsible for being in.

OH MY FUCKING GOD

NO IT ISN'T

HFlihjkane;gbdfkv

Woman putting herself at risk of rape = being alive! Can you understand that?? There is no way to NOT be at risk of rape unless we lock ourselves in bunkers underneath the ground, totally alone!!

She is NOT responsible for being in the situation. It is the mind of the sick rapist that turns any normal situation, walking around, partying, whatever, into 'sex'.

The rapist is responsible for the rape. Jeez if I were a teacher I'd make you write that line 100 times on the black board.

If I decide to go down to the shop and steal a packet of chips, it is not the shop owners fault. I wanted the chips. I moved my own arm and made it take the chips. I moved my feet and walked out of the shop. All these feelings and actions and decisions are my own to make, it is completely my own responsibility. I am the one who perverted the normal and safe and acceptable context of owning a store and selling goods. It was my decision to break the rules. Yes, people break rules. Yes, the shopkeeper can put cameras or whatever up to try and catch me. But he is not at all to blame for owning the chips I wanted to steal. He is not responsible for my decisions or desires or actions. I AM.

I said I disagree with abortion, except in situations like rape and if the child is threatening the mother's life.
So no, I dont agree with late term abortions, seeing as they come under "abortions"
Seriously... That would be obvious.
Others (krexia) have said they agree with abortion, which late term aboritons are a part of. If you dont specify, I cant help but assume you do.
If I say "I like dogs", you would assume I like dogs. But if you were to find out that I only like one breed of dog, that would mean that I was a bit misleading.

tl;dr I am allowed to say 'NO but...'. However, for some reason I don't assume that 'YES but...' exists. When people tell me that in fact it does, I accuse them of changing their positions. Then when I get called out about it, I pretend I didn't understand them in the first place.

Oh, I forgot how she said those differences in her post. Silly me, not reading things that arnt there. How inconsiderate of me.

No, not inconsiderate, just stupid. If you can't understand implicitness then you are failing at communication. Unless you aren't stupid, you are just pretending not to understand what she meant so you could find a 'clever loophole' or something. Except seeing as three people other than krexia understood what she was trying to say and you were the only person who didn't, guess it didn't work, did it?

If I said, "rape is cool" and you were all like "so you think woman getting raped at a party is cool?" and I said "No, idiot, I meant to say I think rape is cool if it were hitler getting raped by some large, violent man because I hate hitler. Man, cant you read! You must be trolling!" you would feel pretty wronged. So, go have a cry somewhere else because you cant blame me for what Krexia didnt specify.

First of all, I wouldn't feel wronged, I would think you were rather disgusting anyway.

Second of all, I'm not crying lol I'm laughing at you for these pathetic attempts you keep using to try and bring krexia down, which aren't working at all

What should we draw from someone saying they are pro-choice? that they dont actually approve of any form of abortion?

Lol, what a double standard.

I disagree with abortion, except in situations like rape and if the child is threatening the mother's life.

What should we draw from someone saying they are pro-life? that they don't actually disapprove of abortion?
 
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There is no way to NOT be at risk of rape unless we lock ourselves in bunkers underneath the ground, totally alone!!

And even that is no guarantee. Seriously. Underground bunkers are no match for me.












Okay, I'm sorry, but I just can't take this thread seriously anymore.
 

Professor Ven

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And even that is no guarantee. Seriously. Underground bunkers are no match for me.












Okay, I'm sorry, but I just can't take this thread seriously anymore.


Underground bunkers would actually make it easier, since most of the time, there's one way in, and one way out.

I just ROFL'd.
 

MomentoMori

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wouldve been nice if she said that the first time

She assumed that you had enough common sense to actually understand that the first time around. She apparently gave you too much credit.

That isnt a specific enough question. Someone may be responsible for the consequences of their actions, but not neccessarily of the situation (other people contribute to a situation too, which wasnt specified but still possible. They could be responsible for some of the consequences too). If a woman puts herself at risk of rape, she isnt responsible for the rapist going to jail and getting beaten to death in a shower, for example, though that is a consequence of the situation the woman is partly responsible for being in.

We have told you again and again and again that the victim is not responsible for some sick fck's action. The woman did not choose to be raped, and don't give any stupid, impractical, and just downright outrageous situations in order to justify your own blatant ignorance, because it isn't working. Everyone here has said that women are not responsible for what their attackers choose to do. You are the only one who can't seem to get that through your head.
 

Chrono Mizaki

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If a woman puts herself at risk of rape, she isnt responsible for the rapist going to jail and getting beaten to death in a shower, for example, though that is a consequence of the situation the woman is partly responsible for being in.

Can we just make you happy, EX and make the woman wear the Burqa? I hear that prevent rapes pretty well.
 

Goldpanner

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Underground bunkers would actually make it easier, since most of the time, there's one way in, and one way out.

I just ROFL'd.

poop, that goes that plan

...what if i install machince gun turrets all around the entrance

NO I GOT IT

what if i buy a helicopter and live in it, far above the world

except i'll need fuel, and i don't want to be responsible for a helicopter fuel guy raping me...
 

Goldpanner

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But what happens if a woman rapes a man? D:

Maybe I will rape the helicopter fuel guy D: i evidently wouldn't have much choice in the matter, rape apparently being an unavoidable consequence of certain actions that are completely his responsibility...
 

krexia

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So, changing your position here?
I have never approved of late-term abortions (after the foetus has developed the neurobiological structures for cognitive function) unless the mother's life is at risk. I don't approve of killing babies, either, just in case that's in doubt.

No child can survive unassisted.
lol. Everyone else in the thread already understood and explained what "unassisted" means in the context of premature birth, so I have nothing to say here.

correct. Having protected sex can directly lead to pregnancy.
And putting oneself at risk of rape can lead directly to pregnancy.

Some situations wouldve been for each answer.
So you admit outright that you cannot take a consistent stance on personal responsibility.
 

_EX

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I have never approved of late-term abortions (after the foetus has developed the neurobiological structures for cognitive function) unless the mother's life is at risk. I don't approve of killing babies, either, just in case that's in doubt.

Maybe I shouldve said "changing your official position".
You said abortion, which includes late term abortions, early abortions and everything in between

lol. Everyone else in the thread already understood and explained what "unassisted" means in the context of premature birth, so I have nothing to say here.
Yeah, well you have your little posse, I dont.
That is a pretty lame argument if you are just using what everyone else has said. When I dont say something directly, you all jump on it because there is room for error. When I do the same thing, you are all defensive and act like your argument never had a flaw.


And putting oneself at risk of rape can lead directly to pregnancy.

Yeah, but you said "putting yourself at risk of rape directly leads to pregnancy"
There was no can about it

So you admit outright that you cannot take a consistent stance on personal responsibility.
I can take a consistant stand. When you make a choice, you are responsible for at least some of the consequences. That is my stance.
You are asking me if I think they are "responsible for all consequences of that situation". The level of responsibility changes depending on situation, I have said that from the start. All hold some responsibility but not in all situations do they hold ALL responsibility.

God Fucking dammit.
 

MomentoMori

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I can take a consistant stand. When you make a choice, you are responsible for at least some of the consequences. That is my stance.

Because as we all know, women make a choice to be raped.

That is a pretty lame argument if you are just using what everyone else has said. When I dont say something directly, you all jump on it because there is room for error. When I do the same thing, you are all defensive and act like your argument never had a flaw.

It's called common sense. But in your case, it apparently isn't so common. At least we know next time that we have to spell out everything for you, or else it'll go a mile over your head.

Krexia isn't the one with the lame arguments - you are. And we're very well aware that our judgments are flawed; we just don't flaunt our ignorance like you have the tendency of doing.

You said abortion, which includes late term abortions, early abortions and everything in between

No it does not.

Abortion in this thread refers to abortions BEFORE late term.

Oh wait, I forgot. We had to spell out the obvious for you in that case too.
 
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