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Film ► Toy Story 4 (2017) - Not a continuation of TS3, standalone



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LostArtist

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This trailer looks... really old and tired. I'm all for a soft reboot, what with the new setting and all, but seriously? It really seems like we're getting a rehash of Toy Story 2, down to the letter. Woody gets lost, Buzz and the Toys go to save him. Woody has existential crisis about being a toy, convinced along by a friendly female toy who tempts him with a better life. Chaos ensues, yada yada yada. Maybe I'm just jaded, but this Toy Story went from "Really? why are they making another one?" to "Oh great, another practically worthless Pixar sequel". It just has Monsters University or FInding Dory written all over it. Movies that are fun to watch at times, but carry very little of that classic Pixar charm, and simply retread the same plot beats as the previous movies.

And calling it now, even though it seems obvious, Bo Peep is the villain of the film. I dunno if it's because she's jaded, or because it's not the same Bo from Toy Story 1, but I guarantee she's the bad guy. We can even hear someone (supiciously Bo Peep sounding) say "Don't let Woody escape!" Yet another twist villain that doesn't need to be here.

Sigh.
I don't know man, this doesn't really give me toy story 2 vibes, that movie doesn't seem to be as deep as this seems to be. And I get the comparisons, but I don't really see the two being all that similar. The 'existential crisis' in 2 was fear of not being wanted by Andy mixed with feeling guilty about Jessie's situation, this seems to be different than that.That voice wasn't bo peep, it was that other female doll in the antique shop.

Idk what other things (aside from the trailer) are going into your judgment of TS4 (if there even is anything else other than the trailer), but I have to say the trailer alone is a well ass made trailer and it gets me hyped/gives me the feels. I just hope it hasn't given too much away, and I hope I'm right about my positive feelings of it.
Also, I agree Dory was kinda meh but monsters university was a great film! how dare you lol! Go watch it again :p

edit: MU isn't even a retread of Monster's inc T___T
 
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SerDuncan

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I don't know man, this doesn't really give me toy story 2 vibes, that movie doesn't seem to be as deep as this seems to be. And I get the comparisons, but I don't really see the two being all that similar. The 'existential crisis' in 2 was fear of not being wanted by Andy mixed with feeling guilty about Jessie's situation, this seems to be different than that.That voice wasn't bo peep, it was that other female doll in the antique shop.

Idk what other things (aside from the trailer) are going into your judgment of TS4 (if there even is anything else other than the trailer), but I have to say the trailer alone is a well ass made trailer and it gets me hyped/gives me the feels. I just hope it hasn't given too much away, and I hope I'm right about my positive feelings of it.
Also, I agree Dory was kinda meh but monsters university was a great film! how dare you lol! Go watch it again :p

edit: MU isn't even a retread of Monster's inc T___T
MU has the same relationship plot as Monsters Inc. Mike and Sully struggle because of their differences, they clash, they break up, but in the end, their friendship is restored. There's nothing inherently wrong with retreading the same ground, but Monsters U lacks a lot of what makes Monsters Inc so unique. One great argument I saw on YouTube once pointed out how if you took the monsters out of MU and replaced them with humans... very little of the plot, or the world design would change. In Monsters Inc, the world is unique, it's designed to accommodate thousands of different monster types. But Monsters U is just a human campus... with monsters on it. And that reflects the whole film as well. It's not a Monster movie with a school theme. It's a school film with monsters haphazardly stuffed in.

You're right about Bo Peep, that's no prob whatsoever.

Just cause a trailer is well made doesn't make the film good. I'm less frustrated with the design of the trailer (which was, as you said, well made, even if it did potentially give too much away. I love the Beach Boys too, so props for that) I'm more frustrated with the plot.

Sure, you pointed out specifics that are different, but at their core... it's the same film structure. That film was about not wanted by Andy, yes, but it was also about Woody wanting a different life where he was loved by more than just one boy. It was about his greed. He wasn't going to do it for Jessie, he was going to do it for himself. She was simply a strong factor in it all. That's the same (at least in the trailer) of this film. Woody doesn't think about staying because Bo Peep wants him to, he considers staying because he wonders what life would be like as a toy loved by many, many people. The core structure of "Woody gets lost, the toys save him" was instrumental to Toy Story 2, and that's exactly what the other toys appear to do in this film as well. Forky may very well add a new wrinkle, but he doesn't even appear to be the focus in this trailer, like the two teasers before showed.

And lastly, Toy Story 2 is deep. I can't say anything for this films, since it's not out yet, but Toy Story 2 is probably Woody's most introspective moment. We have him struggling with celebrity and fame, versus the love of one person. We see the loneliness and fear of abandonment that Jessie struggles with, and how her and the Prospector manifest it in different ways. We see Buzz forced to confront who he used to be (quite literally) and come to terms with how he is now, versus how he used to be. Powerful stuff. People always brush aside Toy Story 2, but it truly is a film that had something to say, it had a message, it had a story to tell. What does this trailer have? We already had our conclusion... the toys had their arcs. Why is Woody being forced to repeat the same character arc for a third time now?
 

LostArtist

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MU has the same relationship plot as Monsters Inc. Mike and Sully struggle because of their differences, they clash, they break up, but in the end, their friendship is restored. There's nothing inherently wrong with retreading the same ground, but Monsters U lacks a lot of what makes Monsters Inc so unique. One great argument I saw on YouTube once pointed out how if you took the monsters out of MU and replaced them with humans... very little of the plot, or the world design would change. In Monsters Inc, the world is unique, it's designed to accommodate thousands of different monster types. But Monsters U is just a human campus... with monsters on it. And that reflects the whole film as well. It's not a Monster movie with a school theme. It's a school film with monsters haphazardly stuffed in.

You're right about Bo Peep, that's no prob whatsoever.

Just cause a trailer is well made doesn't make the film good. I'm less frustrated with the design of the trailer (which was, as you said, well made, even if it did potentially give too much away. I love the Beach Boys too, so props for that) I'm more frustrated with the plot.

Sure, you pointed out specifics that are different, but at their core... it's the same film structure. That film was about not wanted by Andy, yes, but it was also about Woody wanting a different life where he was loved by more than just one boy. It was about his greed. He wasn't going to do it for Jessie, he was going to do it for himself. She was simply a strong factor in it all. That's the same (at least in the trailer) of this film. Woody doesn't think about staying because Bo Peep wants him to, he considers staying because he wonders what life would be like as a toy loved by many, many people. The core structure of "Woody gets lost, the toys save him" was instrumental to Toy Story 2, and that's exactly what the other toys appear to do in this film as well. Forky may very well add a new wrinkle, but he doesn't even appear to be the focus in this trailer, like the two teasers before showed.

And lastly, Toy Story 2 is deep. I can't say anything for this films, since it's not out yet, but Toy Story 2 is probably Woody's most introspective moment. We have him struggling with celebrity and fame, versus the love of one person. We see the loneliness and fear of abandonment that Jessie struggles with, and how her and the Prospector manifest it in different ways. We see Buzz forced to confront who he used to be (quite literally) and come to terms with how he is now, versus how he used to be. Powerful stuff. People always brush aside Toy Story 2, but it truly is a film that had something to say, it had a message, it had a story to tell. What does this trailer have? We already had our conclusion... the toys had their arcs. Why is Woody being forced to repeat the same character arc for a third time now?
Well I know just because a trailer is good, doesn't mean the film is lol. I'm strictly talking about the trailer.

About monster's university, sure you can say that about it with the school stuff, but it doesn't make it any less charming. again I get the comparisons, but still feel they are hugely different films. MU is a big huge spotlight on Mike, and just completely different overall. To call it retreading of monsters inc feels very very wrong.

Woody is not struggling with fame in that movie at all, sure he sees all the stuff he's in, but that's really not what it's about. sure he's proud of it and is reassured about his greatness, but he never really craves it and it never really becomes part of his decision making. It's only a way for him to try to tell himself and his friends he's making the right decision. It was always about Andy, and the only great force against it was Jessie and her story, which even then ties back to Andy and the fear of not being liked. Sure he was doing it for himself, but not because of greed. It was always a fear based decision, never a greed based decision (any signs of that are him trying to assure himself it's the right decision) I can continue tomorrow with specific examples but I have to go to bed.
 
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