How old is the Earth

[Phoenix]

Um no, simply don't do both.
In God's eyes, they are the same.
Lying is just as evil as murder.
They're both things you shouldn't do. That doesn't downscale murder, if anything it upscales lying.

But since I'm not Christian, you're essentially telling non-Christians it's ok for them to murder.

Mmmk. Since science backs up your beliefs of course.
I'm not too quick to science, it's told a lot of *concrete* things that scientists end up disagreeing on later. Just my opinion.

Example?

 

[Dogenzaka]

But since I'm not Christian, you're essentially telling non-Christians it's ok for them to murder.

Where do you get "because lying is as bad as murder, you really shouldn't do both of them" and turn it into "it's ok to murder"?
You're not a Christian. Why are you associating yourself to Biblical standards if nothing could convince you to believe it?

Example?

Earth being flat.
Bleeding healing sickness.
Sulfur healing.
Before hygiene
Greeks thinking different organs controlled different emotions and virtues.
Sun revolving around the earth.
There not being a North/South America.
etc. etc.

 

[Square Ninja]

Earth being flat.
Bleeding healing sickness.
Sulfur healing.
Before hygiene
Greeks thinking different organs controlled different emotions and virtues.
Sun revolving around the earth.
There not being a North/South America.

They're pretty much arguments made out of ignorance, not science. We have measurements, observations, and calculations to confirm what we know now.

 

[violent_anger]

coughisplutoaplanetcoughcough

 

[Square Ninja]

coughisplutoaplanetcoughcough

Pluto had always been in an iffy state with scientists. It was only kind of considered a planet to begin with.

 

[KrytenKoro]

Pluto had always been in an iffy state with scientists. It was only kind of considered a planet to begin with.

Oh give it a rest. So one of them caught you on something, big deal. Admit it and move on.

 

[Dogenzaka]

They're pretty much arguments made out of ignorance, not science. We have measurements, observations, and calculations to confirm what we know now.

To prove THAT now. Those ideas, of course.
What about "theories" that we have made now? Why can't people be at least a smidge open-minded and accept the fact that perhaps many things we know now could not be so true in the future? Like certain medications being "medically safe", yet now they're on recall for calling heart problems, etc.

 

[The Marauder]

Don't start semantic arguments. Gravity is a theory. :closedeyes:

 

[Dogenzaka]

Don't start semantic arguments. Gravity is a theory.

Gravity is a Scientific Law.

"The Law of Gravity"

 

[Square Ninja]

Oh give it a rest. So one of them caught you on something, big deal. Admit it and move on.

NO U

To prove THAT now. Those ideas, of course.
What about "theories" that we have made now? Why can't people be at least a smidge open-minded and accept the fact that perhaps many things we know now could not be so true in the future? Like certain medications being "medically safe", yet now they're on recall for calling heart problems, etc.

Scientists are open-minded. It may seem as though they aren't because of the scrutiny new discoveries face, but that's what gives successful findings legitimacy. Do you simply think that once the scientific community makes one discovery they accept it as the absolute truth of the universe? To simply dismiss what science knows now because we don't "know" absolutely everything is pretty stupid.

Gravity is a Scientific Law.

"The Law of Gravity"

The concept of Gravity itself is a theory.

 

[Dogenzaka]

Scientists are open-minded. It may seem as though they aren't because of the scrutiny new discoveries face, but that's what gives successful findings legitimacy.

Well I'm talking about the various people I know who are like "NO YOU DON'T. SCIENCE IS GOD. STFU *bows in front of Charles Darwin*." Lol

The concept of Gravity itself is a theory.

A theory that repeats itself constantly is a law.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_gravity

Gravity has been there since always, and it's proven, and has never changed once, and we know gravity doesn't exist in space, because people have been there

 

[Square Ninja]

Well I'm talking about the various people I know who are like "NO YOU DON'T. SCIENCE IS GOD. STFU *bows in front of Charles Darwin*." Lol

They're the same kind of people that follow their religion blindly. See South Park.

A theory that repeats itself constantly is a law.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_gravity

Like I said, there are laws that deal with gravity, but gravity itself is a scientific theory.

Gravity has been there since always, and it's proven, and has never changed once, and we know gravity doesn't exist in space, because people have been there

Gravity exists in space. How do you think the planets orbit the sun?

 

[Dogenzaka]

They're the same kind of people that follow their religion blindly. See South Park.

Beliefs and Religion do not change over time.
Science changes constantly over time.
Those who accept the science of today as the permanent truth of tomorrow, are fools.

Like I said, there are laws that deal with gravity, but gravity itself is a scientific theory.

If you say so, like I said, I know gravity's been here since forever, and it never has changed.

Gravity exists in space. How do you think the planets orbit the sun?

Gah, I mean like when astronauts leave the earth's atmosphere, they are no longer held by the Earth's gravity.

 

[violent_anger]

gravity changed, -_-
ever heard of Einstein?

edit: wow, they made that a smiley now? he looks asian...

 

[Phoenix]

Where do you get "because lying is as bad as murder, you really shouldn't do both of them" and turn it into "it's ok to murder"?
You're not a Christian. Why are you associating yourself to Biblical standards if nothing could convince you to believe it?

A hypothetical situation, Dogen. So you're telling me since, I'm going to hell anyway, it doesn't matter if I kill or rape, no? I mean, I lie, I lust, I ency and I grow angry. Why avoid murder?

Earth being flat.
Bleeding healing sickness.
Sulfur healing.
Before hygiene
Greeks thinking different organs controlled different emotions and virtues.
Sun revolving around the earth.
There not being a North/South America.
etc. etc.

Like SN said, the scientific method was not used for these. They just made assumptions.

Beliefs and Religion do not change over time.
Science changes constantly over time.
Those who accept the science of today as the permanent truth of tomorrow, are fools.

Incidentally, this is what gives science it's legitimacy. Science changes when new information is discovered. Religion doesn't.

If you say so, like I said, I know gravity's been here since forever, and it never has changed.

However, it is a theory you don't question. Like the theory of electromagnetism.

Gah, I mean like when astronauts leave the earth's atmosphere, they are no longer held by the Earth's gravity.

Gravity exists absolutely everywhere, just not on a noticeable level.

 

[Dogenzaka]

A hypothetical situation, Dogen. So you're telling me since, I'm going to hell anyway, it doesn't matter if I kill or rape, no? I mean, I lie, I lust, I ency and I grow angry. Why avoid murder?

That's your choice. If you want to murder, go ahead. The only thing in your way is the law. Like I say, without religion, morals don't stand.

Like SN said, the scientific method was not used for these. They just made assumptions.

Then scientific method also was not used to?
Discover electricity
Build ships
Make compasses
Use natural medicine
and other things that happened before the "scientific method" that is still used today.

Incidentally, this is what gives science it's legitimacy. Science changes when new information is discovered. Religion doesn't.

Simply because religion doesn't have to conflict with science's findings. So religion believes that everything in existance was created? Good. Until someone can prove that something DIDN'T cause the Big Bang to happen, etc., then those views don't conflict.

However, it is a theory you don't question.

Simply because, I'm jumping right now, and I keep falling.

 

[KrytenKoro]

A hypothetical situation, Dogen. So you're telling me since, I'm going to hell anyway, it doesn't matter if I kill or rape, no? I mean, I lie, I lust, I ency and I grow angry. Why avoid murder?

If you are rejecting goodness, then sure, you're going to hell. It really doesn'tmatter what way you choose to reject goodness - if you tell God to go away, he'll leave you alone for the afterlife. The whole point of hell is that God IS hope - and thus being infinitely away from God is ineffable despair, and no good thing will happen to you. Not as punishment - as consequence.
By the way, "anger" is not one of the seven deadlies. Wrath is - spiteful anger, where you allow hatred to rule your actions. Merely being angry with someone is not considered wrong - both Jesus and God did it.

Like I say, without religion, morals don't stand.

I wouldn't say that. Biological precepts can be used as morals - it's just that it often happens that those who reject religious morality don't think through and make their supposedly "better" brutally logical ones - they just do what makes them feel good (activism, "liberation"), and call that being a good person.
Now, there are agnostics/atheists who do think up brutally logical moralities based on biological precepts, etc. But they are often ignored as too cold or not liberal/"progressive" enough.

Discover electricity

No

Build ships

Yes

Make compasses

Yes

Use natural medicine

Not necessarily

Incidentally, this is what gives science it's legitimacy. Science changes when new information is discovered. Religion doesn't.

That's not legitimacy, that's openness. And scienTISTS are not the saintly, open figures that you seem to imply - stubbornness to GREAT SCALE has been a major factor (on the part of major, respected scientists even! - see Hubble Telescope/Far Galaxy controversy) of science - and info-picking is a long-honored tradition.

In PRINCIPLE, science is legitimate because of this. But then, so was communism.
As for religion changing when new information is discovered - Jesus Christ, Siddhartha Buddha, the Upanishads, the Jewish Prophets, Mohammed - religion is quite open to change. The Change just has to prove itself first. Unlike in science, where the change just has to not be previously disproven.

To wit: In religion, change is guilty until proven innocent - to much is at stake to just go along with fads. In science, change is innocent until proven guilty - a theory can survive so long as it is not conclusively disproven.

Though, in retrospect, the very permutability of science that you claim would make it illegitimate - it cannot be relied upon for permanent truth, as it's very foundation state that is is based on assumptions - very convincing ones, but assumptions nonetheless. On the other hand, religions state that they are based on the Truth given to them by one who is Supreme, and Divine.

Einstein: he didn't change the theory of gravity, he furthered it, and showed the consequences of the theory - they include bending. Gravity still does the same thing it always was supposed to do.

Simply because, I'm jumping right now, and I keep falling.

Must be damn hard to type.

 

[Dogenzaka]

Merely being angry with someone is not considered wrong - both Jesus and God did it.

He's right. This is what is called as "righteous anger"

 

[KrytenKoro]

<-- This comment was removed at the poster's request -->

 

[violent_anger]

without religion, moralsare just what that one person beleives is right or wrong, and that person might think stealing is OK, or something else tot hat effect

and pho, theories are unlikely to be entirely wrong, but they can change, einstein changed the theory of gravity,a fter all.

edit: yes, he did change it, newton believed in gravitons, i think, and he thought that those, like magnets, caused gravity. einstein believed that it was actually that mass warps space-time, or soemthing.