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Birth by Sleep has been thought of since KH1.



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Sacred X

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This is a mixture of speculation and theory.

There were periods of time where I haven't been around the forums, so this might be old news. Either way, I'll explain myself. I'm writing this particularly because some people claim Nomura hadn't intended to go past KH1 or that he had no idea how the story would follow.

First I'll start off with Riku. One thing that was very odd when I first played KH was when Destiny Islands is overrun by heartless, Riku was saying things like "The door has opened", and similar things. We, the players, had no idea what he meant. How would Riku know about such a thing? I'm going to assume such knowledge came from Terra. I also support this because he was saying something along the lines of "I'm not afraid of the darkness" as the darkness was consuming him on Destiny Islands. I know Terra is related to darkness based on things MX has said in the trailer, something along the lines of the Keyblade shouldn't be in the hands of someone who submits to darkness or weilds darkness. Something along those lines. It's not very solid, but how else would Riku know what the door is? Some people also claim Terra chose Riku to be a keyblade master, which would support this part.

I also noticed on Destiny Islands, Kairi tells Sora how Riku has changed. I'm going to assume this has something to do with Terra's influence on Riku. I know it seems very small, but it seems very random for that piece of dialouge to take place without some sort of meaning behind it.

Lastly, I don't know if Agrabah has been confirmed for BBS or not. But either way, it's obvious it will be in. I am playing KH1 right now, and Sora is telling Alladin about the Keyhole. The Genie says something like "Keyhole? I could swear I've heard that somewhere before."
How else would a Disney character know of such a thing? The Genie has been around for more than 200 years, and BBS was a while before KH1, so it's possible he just forgot about it or something opposed to it being a mere legend he heard about randomly. Besides, it seems very random for him to say something like that without saying where he heard it from or anything. It just seems like a clue Nomura gave us, since he seems to love doing that.

Anyway, if this is all old, just say so. It's just small bits I've noticed while playing KH1 over anyway.
 
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Audo

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This is a mixture of speculation and theory.

There were periods of time where I haven't been around the forums, so this might be old news. Either way, I'll explain myself. I'm writing this particularly because some people claim Nomura hadn't intended to go past KH1 or that he had no idea how the story would follow.

First I'll start off with Riku. One thing that was very odd when I first played KH was when Destiny Islands is overrun by heartless, Riku was saying things like "The door has opened", and similar things. We, the players, had no idea what he meant. How would Riku know about such a thing? I'm going to assume such knowledge came from Terra.
Um, yes we did know... Xehanort said a similar thing to Sora about the world being connected, and then there was that door in the Secret Place. Then we go to check after Riku disappears and it opens...

I also support this because he was saying something along the lines of "I'm not afraid of the darkness" as the darkness was consuming him on Destiny Islands. I know Terra is related to darkness based on things MX has said in the trailer, something along the lines of the Keyblade shouldn't be in the hands of someone who submits to darkness or weilds darkness. Something along those lines. It's not very solid, but how else would Riku know what the door is? Some people also claim Terra chose Riku to be a keyblade master, which would support this part.
I find it hard to believe Terra told some 5 year old kid all about Doors and Darkness.

I also noticed on Destiny Islands, Kairi tells Sora how Riku has changed. I'm going to assume this has something to do with Terra's influence on Riku. I know it seems very small, but it seems very random for that piece of dialouge to take place without some sort of meaning behind it
Terra has no influence on Riku at that part. It was 10 years after BBS and Terra had been long gone. If anything, Riku had changed because he had continuously become more obsessed with leaving the islands.

Lastly, I don't know if Agrabah has been confirmed for BBS or not.
It hasn't.

But either way, it's obvious it will be in. I am playing KH1 right now, and Sora is telling Alladin about the Keyhole. The Genie says something like "Keyhole? I could swear I've heard that somewhere before."
How else would a Disney character know of such a thing? The Genie has been around for more than 200 years, and BBS was a while before KH1, so it's possible he just forgot about it or something opposed to it being a mere legend he heard about randomly.
BBS = 10 years ago. Not 200.
And Genie actually says:
KH1 said:
Genie: Keyhole, eh? I could swear I’ve heard about that somewhere before...

Donald: Really? Where?

Genie: Now, where was it? It’s only been 200 years...

Besides, it seems very random for him to say something like that without saying where he heard it from or anything. It just seems like a clue Nomura gave us, since he seems to love doing that.
It just seems to be them showing that the Keyblades, or at least the Keyholes, have been around for a long, long time. Not necessarily setting anything up for BBS.

Anyway, if this is all old, just say so. It's just small bits I've noticed while playing KH1 over anyway.
While i think Nomura clearly had some idea as to what had happened in the past of KH (this is evident by the End of the World). I find it hard to doubt that he had gone so far as to think of some character that would have influenced and told Riku things when he was a small child. Nomura didn't even have the name or appearance of Terra down until sometime after KH2 was released. Not to mention they didn't even know if KH would continue or not. If anything he was just laying down some groundwork in case if it could go in that direction. But saying that he actually had BBS planned back then would be an overstatement, imo.
 

Sacred X

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I find it hard to believe Terra told some 5 year old kid all about Doors and Darkness.

I find it hard to believe a couple of kids and disney characters can save worlds multiple times and defeat Sephiroth. But who are we to judge?

Terra has no influence on Riku at that part. It was 10 years after BBS and Terra had been long gone. If anything, Riku had changed because he had continuously become more obsessed with leaving the islands.

How would you know? We've already seem Terra watch Riku and Sora play together on the islands. Who's to say there's no dialogue?


BBS = 10 years ago. Not 200.

Never said it was 200 years ago. Nevertheless, I still wouldn't be surprized to see the Genie in BBS whether he be a summon or have some small part in the story.



It just seems to be them showing that the Keyblades, or at least the Keyholes, have been around for a long, long time. Not necessarily setting anything up for BBS.

Maybe, maybe not. Nomura likes to makes us speculate, since he thinks games should involve more of that. or something. I don't have the text on me right now.


While i think Nomura clearly had some idea as to what had happened in the past of KH (this is evident by the End of the World). I find it hard to doubt that he had gone so far as to think of some character that would have influenced and told Riku things when he was a small child. Nomura didn't even have the name or appearance of Terra down until sometime after KH2 was released. Not to mention they didn't even know if KH would continue or not. If anything he was just laying down some groundwork in case if it could go in that direction. But saying that he actually had BBS planned back then would be an overstatement, imo.

Well, I don't think he had everything set up right to the core. I just believe he had a few "general ideas" in place.
 

JaymeeRaine

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I think it's a plausible theory. Good job, Sacred. I don't know how solidly the idea was developed during KH1, but there are certainly fitting ties. I've always been a little confused by some of the arbitrary statements made in KH1, but that theory clears quite a few of them up. Hooray!
 
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Audo

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I find it hard to believe a couple of kids and disney characters can save worlds multiple times and defeat Sephiroth. But who are we to judge?
I find it more believable that a bunch of teenagers can save the world than some 20 year old guy telling a five year old how to successfully destroy his own world.

How would you know? We've already seem Terra watch Riku and Sora play together on the islands. Who's to say there's no dialogue?
So you're saying he talked to Riku and then 10 years later, that finally influenced change in Riku? Yeah... doubtful.

Never said it was 200 years ago. Nevertheless, I still wouldn't be surprized to see the Genie in BBS whether he be a summon or have some small part in the story.
I doubt Agrabah will be in BBS.

Maybe, maybe not. Nomura likes to makes us speculate, since he thinks games should involve more of that. or something. I don't have the text on me right now.
Exactly, he likes to let fans speculate so he puts in very loose groundwork. Just enough so that there is something to speculate with, but nothing that will actually get you anywhere.

Well, I don't think he had everything set up right to the core. I just believe he had a few "general ideas" in place.
I'm sure he did have a few ideas, but nothing that would actually be warranted enough to say that BBS had been thought of since KH1.
 
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Audo

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Aladdin and the King of Theives. See it, live it, love it.
I have seen it, but just because there is a chance for a world to be in BBS due to a movie (See: Atlantica and Ariel's Beginning) that doesn't mean it will be. Agrabah is already set to be in Days, I doubt they would put it in BBS (especially since BBS seems to be focusing on the PoH worlds that we haven't been to.)
 

Sexy Angel
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Thats your opinion, so you aren't correct.

KeeLed.
 

Antiquity

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Your idea does have some flaws and R-K pretty much hit them all.
I doubt Nomura even really planned to release not just BBS, but Coded and 358/2 Days while he was making KH, much less think about them. He basically makes things up as he goes until he plans ahead IMO.
 

E.J.

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I dont think thats true. After KH1, they probably thought of KHFM and KHCoM. THen, they probably thought of KH2, KH2FM+, and KH ReCoM. Then after that, BBS, Coded, and Days.
 
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Audo

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*shrugs* we weren't really given a timeframe for Days, but for Coded it all depends when that meeting where he was drunk happened.
 

Master Riku 789

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It might be possible that Nomura is basing things in BBS off of things in KH1. Like genie metioning the keyholes, Nomura could have looked at KH1 and said, "Oh I could use this thing in KH1 and make a plot for it in BBS."
 
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Audo

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I don't see how Keyholes being there 200 years in the past would help BBS at all...
 
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