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[DISCUSSION] The Problem with the Master of Master's plan of using the Foretellers and Union Leaders as sacrificial vessels for 13 Darknesses.



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EighteenEighty

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In UX Finale, The Master has a plan of defeating the 13 Darknesses by giving them physical forms. 7 will be locked inside the Foretellers and 5 will be locked inside the Union Leaders while 1 Darkness will be trapped inside the datascape. However, Luxu disagreed with this plan because too many people are being sacrificed. But the Master mentioned that he has a safety plan to save the Foretellers and Union Leaders from being possessed. Sadly Luxu doubted this. But what if, the safety plan or Plan B that MoM mentioned is Luxu's betrayal? Luxu is going to come up with another plan on how to defeat the 13 Darknesses without sacrificing anyone. He is going to rewrite the Master's grand plan against the 13 Darknesses. By creating data backups of the Foretellers and Union Leaders and use them as sacrificial vessels instead.

Ventus and Skuld already met the data backups of Ava and the Master in UX as glitches inside the datascape from UX. Lauriam even pointed out that what if the data backups of the Union Leaders also exist inside the Data Daybreak Town. And what if someone will gain access to them? Like her sister Strelitzia. I mean if a data backup like Data-Sora can manifest a heart of its own like in Re: Coded. Do you think it would make sense if they will be used as sacrificial vessels instead? Because at the end of the day, they are just beings that are made out of data. But of course, they need a body or a vessel to possess like a replica in order to help them travel and communicate in the real world. Because in my opinion, they can only appear as hearts if they travel in the real world like Robed Ansem, and their body is made out of glitches/data anyway.

But sadly the plan wouldn't work and the Master will disagree with this because replicas back then in the Age of Fairytales don't exist yet. However. Since many years have passed. Who knows that Luxu/Xigbar will use Even/Vexen to create 13 Replicas for the vessels of 13 Darknesses? And as the Master said, Luxu will be the key to the future. Even if Luxu betrays the grand plan of the Master of Masters he is still going to come up with a better idea on how to execute it without sacrificing anyone.
 

Nelo Angelo

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That's a pretty good idea. But I have a feeling Luxu will have the biggest reveal of all during the endgame of this whole saga. Something the Master did not foresee of his Apprentice. The "old friend" can play the long game too...
 

Master Exin

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Do we even know where these thirteen darknesses are currently? We know for sure the seven lights are within certain Princesses (Kairi, Elsa, Anna, Rapunzel, and three others).
 

Antifa Lockhart

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Kind of. Maybe.

We're lead to believe that 7 are within the foretellers and the Master.

Four were sealed away in the corridor between the Data world and the real world at the end of KHUX.

One was destroyed as Daybreak Town fell.

And the final one was inside Ventus and later was ripped from the whole and created Vanitas.
 

Nelo Angelo

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The one that was "destroyed" when Daybreak town fell. How quaint. We are told they do not face destruction unless they are intertwined with a vessel. So was this truly destroyed? Or did it find a vessel with the ones we know were in daybreak town as it came to meet it's demise? Interesting.
 

Antifa Lockhart

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We don't know, this is just what Xehanort states in Dark Road so it's possible that they could all come back
 

LoneFox

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One was destroyed as Daybreak Town fell.
I don't think so. If it was possible to destroy them that way, wouldn't the MoM have arranged it so that all (or at least most) of them would have been in Daybreak Town when it was destroyed?

I see four possibilities for that remaining minor Darkness:
  1. It is for Lauriam. It could have gone into him already when he was unconscious after fighting Maleficent. Note how Lauriam had already left before the four Darknesses got trapped, while Brain, Ephemer, and Skuld were still around. It makes sense that three of the four were meant for them. If this is the truth, then I expect it to be one of the main enemies in KH4, as an obstacle that prevents Lauriam and Strelitzia from reuniting.
  2. It is for Brain, in which case we will fight against it in Missing-Link.
  3. It is for Ephemer, in which case it is responsible for turning him into Yozora, and removing it from him will likely be the main quest in Verum Rex.
  4. It is for Skuld. The main argument for this is, it's the least suspicious case, and that often tends to be the correct one :unsure: . If so, there isn't really much to say. It may show up in any (or none) of the upcoming games.
All of these options have some merit. If I had to bet on one, I would go with #3, but that's basically just an educated guess.
 

Master Exin

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Interesting thoughts. If we assume that Vanitas was/is in fact one of those thirteen original darknesses, that may leave a question of his current fate now. Has he been put back into a dormant state deep within Ventus? Or has he truly been vanquished for good?

Not to mention, apologies if I sound a bit naive and if this seems a bit diverting from the original topic, but even if the seven light light pieces and thirteen dark pieces shattered from the x-blade are in some way separate from the seven Princesses of Heart and thirteen Pure Darknesses, could the seven Princesses of Heart and thirteen Pure Darknesses, in question, still be connected opposites to one another? Having co-existed as long as time and Kingdom Hearts and the x-blade itself? Whether passing on from host to host.
 

Antifa Lockhart

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I don't think so.
That's just what was said in Dark Road, so it's fun to speculate otherwise but that's the current canon line to the best of our knowledge. Even if doubt is thrown over it, that's what Xehanort believed as of BBS
 

EighteenEighty

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I don't think so. If it was possible to destroy them that way, wouldn't the MoM have arranged it so that all (or at least most) of them would have been in Daybreak Town when it was destroyed?

I see four possibilities for that remaining minor Darkness:
  1. It is for Lauriam. It could have gone into him already when he was unconscious after fighting Maleficent. Note how Lauriam had already left before the four Darknesses got trapped, while Brain, Ephemer, and Skuld were still around. It makes sense that three of the four were meant for them. If this is the truth, then I expect it to be one of the main enemies in KH4, as an obstacle that prevents Lauriam and Strelitzia from reuniting.
  2. It is for Brain, in which case we will fight against it in Missing-Link.
  3. It is for Ephemer, in which case it is responsible for turning him into Yozora, and removing it from him will likely be the main quest in Verum Rex.
  4. It is for Skuld. The main argument for this is, it's the least suspicious case, and that often tends to be the correct one :unsure: . If so, there isn't really much to say. It may show up in any (or none) of the upcoming games.
All of these options have some merit. If I had to bet on one, I would go with #3, but that's basically just an educated guess.
For now, we don't know what happened to the Darkness that escaped the Data Daybreak Town. All we know so far is that this Darkness is the one who helped Maleficent to go back in her current timeline from KH2 and also the one who interacted with Luxu. After their interaction, there's a possibility that it vanished and escaped. What if this Darkness will be the one who will reunite the other 12 Darknesses? Luxu promised this Darkness alongside the other 12 to give them vessels to possess in the future in the form of data backups. So that they can finally be vanquished.
 
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EighteenEighty

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Interesting thoughts. If we assume that Vanitas was/is in fact one of those thirteen original darknesses, that may leave a question of his current fate now. Has he been put back into a dormant state deep within Ventus? Or has he truly been vanquished for good?

Not to mention, apologies if I sound a bit naive and if this seems a bit diverting from the original topic, but even if the seven light light pieces and thirteen dark pieces shattered from the x-blade are in some way separate from the seven Princesses of Heart and thirteen Pure Darknesses, could the seven Princesses of Heart and thirteen Pure Darknesses, in question, still be connected opposites to one another? Having co-existed as long as time and Kingdom Hearts and the x-blade itself? Whether passing on from host to host.
We still don't have a valid answer to what really happened between the 20 pieces of the X-blade that got shattered long ago. In fact, the X-blade that we saw in BBS and KH3 are just man-made or artificial.

All Master Xehanort did is to create his OWN X-blade without using the REAL pieces of the X-blade. He created his own 13 Darknesses by using Organization 13 while the Princesses of Heart were supposed to be used as 7 Lights if the 7 Guardians of Light didn't show up or complete their numbers. How can we compare the X-blade that Master Xehanort created and the X-blade that coexists a long time ago? Are there two different X-blades? Who knows. However, if we analyzed what Master Xehanort said in DDD.
"In ancient times, people believed that light was a gift from an unseen land by the name of Kingdom Hearts. But Kingdom Hearts was safeguarded by its counterpart, the X-blade. Warriors vied for that precious light, thus beginning the "Keyblade War." The violent clash shattered the X-blade into twenty pieces—seven of light, and thirteen of darkness. And the only real Kingdom Hearts was swallowed by the darkness, never to surface again."
So if we can analyze what MX said in DDD. The X-blade was used as a counterpart of Kingdom Hearts. It acted as a protector. It is also the original or the real X-blade than what MX created did. However, since many people wanted to use the power of Kingdom Hearts for their own selfish needs they have to use the X-blade in order to gain dominance and power. The war started and many people died for the X-blade until someone finally wielded it, but the X-blade got shattered into 20 Pieces—seven of light, and thirteen of darkness. Shattering the X-blade also means losing Kingdom Hearts, the source of all light.

Now the question here is, what happened to 7 light and 13 dark pieces of the X-blade? People keep saying that the 7 light pieces became the 7 Princesses of Heart but after analyzing what Yen Sid to Mickey in DDD.

Yensid: "The Keyblade Wars of yore plunged the true Kingdom Hearts into darkness, and the X-blade was shattered. But the light still shining in the hearts of children rebuilt the world that we know today. And the light from the broken X-blade was then divided into seven, to protect the number of pure hearts in the world."
Mickey:
"Seven pure lights. They're...the princesses of heart."
Yensid:
"Indeed. Those seven pure hearts form the very source of all light in the world. If they are lost, the world will again give way to shadow. Thus, even if we deliberately avoid finding our seven lights to avert another Keyblade War, Xehanort will still target the seven princesses in order to forge the X-blade."

Now according to what Yen Sid said the world was rebuilt by the children (possibly the Dandelions from KHUX). But the only thing that confuses me is "the light from the broken X-blade was then divided into seven, to protect the number of pure hearts in the world." Are you saying that those broken pieces of the X-blade have been protecting people with hearts of pure light? And I think the number of pure hearts in the world are the Princesses of Heart and also ordinary people with a heart of pure light.

Maybe having a heart of pure light can be used as an advantage to become a piece of the X-blade or for something else. In KH1, Maleficent wanted to use the 7 Princesses of Heart to summon the Final Keyhole. In KH3, Xehanort wants to use the 7 Guardians of Light and the 7 Princesses of Heart for backup plan as the 7 light pieces for his OWN X-blade. Even though the X-blade that we saw in KH3 is not the REAL one because it's artificial or man-made by using the 7 Guardians of Light and 13 Seekers of Darknesses as its pieces, it can still use and summon the power of Kingdom Hearts.

Maybe the 7 broken light pieces of the Original X-blade that existed long ago became their own being. I mean if we have being name Darkness and there are 13 of them. Do you think it would make sense if there's a being called Light, and there's 7 of them?

So in conclusion. What if, The 7 light pieces of the X-blade became the 7 Willful Lights and they possessed physical forms back then? Similar to the 13 Willful Darknesses who also possesses physical forms back then and I think the 13 Willful Darknesses are the 13 Dark pieces of the X-blade. Each of these shattered pieces has gained access into people's hearts. 7 who are aligned with the light, and 13 who are aligned with the darkness. The 7 Willful Lights are the ones who are protecting the number of pure hearts in the world just like Yen Sid said. While the 13 Willful Darknesses are the ones who are infecting different worlds with darkness and corrupting it with Heartless.

I can already imagine the war between 7 Willful Lights and 13 Willful Darknesses is also the same war that the Master of Masters participated in when he was a boy.
 

Master Exin

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We still don't have a valid answer to what really happened between the 20 pieces of the X-blade that got shattered long ago. In fact, the X-blade that we saw in BBS and KH3 are just man-made or artificial.

All Master Xehanort did is to create his OWN X-blade without using the REAL pieces of the X-blade. He created his own 13 Darknesses by using Organization 13 while the Princesses of Heart were supposed to be used as 7 Lights if the 7 Guardians of Light didn't show up or complete their numbers. How can we compare the X-blade that Master Xehanort created and the X-blade that coexists a long time ago? Are there two different X-blades? Who knows. However, if we analyzed what Master Xehanort said in DDD.

So if we can analyze what MX said in DDD. The X-blade was used as a counterpart of Kingdom Hearts. It acted as a protector. It is also the original or the real X-blade than what MX created did. However, since many people wanted to use the power of Kingdom Hearts for their own selfish needs they have to use the X-blade in order to gain dominance and power. The war started and many people died for the X-blade until someone finally wielded it, but the X-blade got shattered into 20 Pieces—seven of light, and thirteen of darkness. Shattering the X-blade also means losing Kingdom Hearts, the source of all light.Maybe having a heart of pure light can be used as an advantage to become a piece of the X-blade or for something else. In KH1, Maleficent wanted to use the 7 Princesses of Heart to summon the Final Keyhole. In KH3, Xehanort wants to use the 7 Guardians of Light and the 7 Princesses of Heart for backup plan as the 7 light pieces for his OWN X-blade. Even though the X-blade that we saw in KH3 is not the REAL one because it's artificial or man-made by using the 7 Guardians of Light and 13 Seekers of Darknesses as its pieces, it can still use and summon the power of Kingdom Hearts.
I was already aware that the “x-blades” forged in BBS and KHIII were artificial to an extent.

Now according to what Yen Sid said the world was rebuilt by the children (possibly the Dandelions from KHUX). But the only thing that confuses me is "the light from the broken X-blade was then divided into seven, to protect the number of pure hearts in the world." Are you saying that those broken pieces of the X-blade have been protecting people with hearts of pure light? And I think the number of pure hearts in the world are the Princesses of Heart and also ordinary people with a heart of pure light.

Maybe the 7 broken light pieces of the Original X-blade that existed long ago became their own being. I mean if we have being name Darkness and there are 13 of them. Do you think it would make sense if there's a being called Light, and there's 7 of them?

So in conclusion. What if, The 7 light pieces of the X-blade became the 7 Willful Lights and they possessed physical forms back then? Similar to the 13 Willful Darknesses who also possesses physical forms back then and I think the 13 Willful Darknesses are the 13 Dark pieces of the X-blade. Each of these shattered pieces has gained access into people's hearts. 7 who are aligned with the light, and 13 who are aligned with the darkness. The 7 Willful Lights are the ones who are protecting the number of pure hearts in the world just like Yen Sid said. While the 13 Willful Darknesses are the ones who are infecting different worlds with darkness and corrupting it with Heartless.

I can already imagine the war between 7 Willful Lights and 13 Willful Darknesses is also the same war that the Master of Masters participated in when he was a boy.
I would’ve thought the original X-Blade was still intact and separately during the original war between the lights and darks during the MoM’s young childhood, and actually shattered by the outcome of KHX.

It also still leaves the question regarding the nature of the Princesses of Heart, their origin, and who or what their dark counterparts could be. As well as Vanitas’ own nature and current fate.
 

EighteenEighty

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I was already aware that the “x-blades” forged in BBS and KHIII were artificial to an extent.


I would’ve thought the original X-Blade was still intact and separately during the original war between the lights and darks during the MoM’s young childhood, and actually shattered by the outcome of KHX.

It also still leaves the question regarding the nature of the Princesses of Heart, their origin, and who or what their dark counterparts could be. As well as Vanitas’ own nature and current fate.
The X-blade didn't shatter in KHUX. It happened in an unknown era. I can imagine that the MoM participated in that war and saw how the X-blade shattered into 20 pieces. When the X-blade got shattered that's where the war between light and darkness started.

The MoM's war was about fighting the beings known as Darkness. But if they come from the X-Blade, that would mean the war that shattered the X-Blade happened before the MoM's war against Darkness.

So now we have:
  • The Keyblade War that shattered the X-Blade.
  • The MoM's Keyblade War = The eternal war against light and darkness.
  • The Foreteller's Keyblade War destroyed the world.
  • The mini Keyblade War in BbS between TAV and MX.
  • The Keyblade War in KH3.
It also still leaves the question regarding the nature of the Princesses of Heart, their origin,

The Princesses of Heart are just ordinary princesses that possesses a heart of pure light but their hearts can be used as a tool of creating the X-blade or unlocking the Final Keyhole. The Princesses of Heart are not just used as a tool for summoning the X-blade. Other people with a heart of pure light can become a piece of the X-blade. Hence why Sora and his friends became the 7 Guardians of Light. That opposes Xehanort and his group, the 13 Seekers of Darkness. The 7 Guardians of Light and 13 Seekers of Darkness are MX's pieces of his OWN X-blade.

As well as Vanitas’ own nature and current fate.
I can imagine Vanitas was put back into a dormant state deep within Ventus and was trapped inside it after their final encounter in BBS. This explains why the Darkness is still inside Ventus' heart when Sora travels inside Ven's heart from Re: Mind and transformed into Dark Inferno X. Unless the Darkness manages to find a way to possess Ventus again or escape to find a new vessel and reunite with other 12 Darknesses to complete the ranking.
 
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