I'm the only one who liked BBS ?

[Nukara]

Recently, I began to notice more and more that I could have been born from a dream. Because for his existence on the forum, I would never have met a man who did not hate this game. I can not say anything about the gameplay when I watched the passage on YouTube. But I really liked the plot. (Although the one who played it did not claim to play the gameplay) Personally, I like the story and characters in the KH games, and then everything else. And in BBS I got it. Terra, Aqua, Xehanort, Ventus, Vanitas became after this game my favorite characters. In addition, I was very touched by the finale and the secret finale. And it so happened that I prefer the later games KH and KH2, BBS, my favorites. KH1 and Com also liked me, but KH1 after KH2, BBS seemed too childish for me and characters other than Riku, Ansem, Maleficent I was not so attached. If you go back to the BBS itself, then yes, I know that this game has drawbacks, but they are not so great as to call the game bad both in terms of history and in the gameplay. I watched as there was a lot of emotion in this game. And personally, I think that if the game / movie / cartoon causes at least some emotions, then it's good. Maybe this topic will be deleted, but answer in the comments, who likes this game, like I do, or I do not even know, because I already feel very lonely and uncomfortable among those who do not like the game. You feel like a mad fan of K.H. Because it's customary to love KH1 and COM, but I like other games of the series more.

 

[The Dark Mamba]

I like the game's story in the context of it being a prequel. I really love everything once the story hits the Keyblade graveyard and the ending is so tragically beautiful. Also, I thought the game worked pretty well with the whole multi scenario thing and seeing the story take place from 3 different perspectives and what got revealed in each story.

But the gameplay mechanics stink. Bosses are unstaggering pieces of crap that boil down to mainly either spamming block or dodge. I felt like damn fool last month trying to beat Young Xehanort on 1.5+2.5 spamming square like a mad man. I've never bothered trying to beat him with Terra.

The way I like to experience the game now is just watching to intertwined cutscenes of all 3 stories together on YouTube.

[video=youtube;Zzia8BLnQNQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zzia8BLnQNQ[/video]

 

[Sephiroth0812]

Don't mistake the criticism and pointing out flaws of the games for blatant dislike or even hate of the characters or the intended plot though as the true "haters" are indeed a minority among the fanbase, albeit quite a loud one.

I'm personally a fan of BBS and its characters as well, heck, I like TAV individually and their potential as characters more than the entirety of the Organisation save maybe Xigbar/Braig, and the story BBS tried to tell is in principle an interesting one that also had great potential.
The main problem though which even I as a fan of the game can't deny is that the execution and presentation of what BBS tried to do is mediocre at best and the writing and dialogue somewhat lackluster in several areas.

What frustrates me about BBS is not that it is objectively or truly "bad" but that it is a whole assembly of potential which wasn't used effectively in the slightest.

As for the gameplay, this one is subject to heavy debate all across the fandom and do not think that this forum, which is a mere snapshot of the fandom as a whole, holds the superior or true view when you have some people around who leave no opportunity to rant about how "shitty" or unbalanced the gameplay system is.
BBS' system certainly has some rather annoying flaws like the issue with no commands working in the air (except Aqua's barrier), the activation of Command Styles being beyond any of the Player's control (except if you use the Ice cream items) and some bosses being designed really cheap to create an artificial "difficulty" which in reality amounts to nothing but a slugging match of "dodge-dodge-dodge-get 1 hit in-dodge-dodge-get hit-more dodge-use opportunity to heal-more dodge trying to get next hit in-and so forth".

Personally, I found BBS' battle system (and by extension Re: Coded's and DDD's system) in general more enjoyable than the so often praised KH 2 system which, to me, is too much glorified Keyblade whacking, overpowered drive forms and exploiting preset patterns in enemies.
My personal favorite system though and I know I'm in the huge minority with this is Chain of Memories' card system. That one allowed for a level of strategy and pre-planning none of the other systems can match.

 

[Muke]

I don't like BBS' gameplay, that much is clear. But I do love the characters and (especially) the trio it has introduced. TAV is actually my favorite (original) trio. Master Xehanort is finally a good villain (I do like him a lot as a villain, ngl), Vanitas is the edgelord we all needed.

I alao do love the game's storyline, though I agree the execution of a few ideas could've been better. And even though the dialogue is often a bit "ehhh", I just love every single TAV interaction. They have flaws, and that's what makes them good characters. Not everybody is perfect - of course Terra is an idiot for believing and trusting Master Xehanort, but can you blane him at all? He's the old freind of his current master(/father) and an authority role. Yes, Aqua is sometimes too quick to judge Terra, but again, can you blame her? She saw his Darkness with her own eyes, and with Eraqus telling her non-stop that his Darkness, or Darkness in general, is the most evil thing on earth... and then all the Disney villains? I definitely couldn't blame her. And then there's Ven who keeps running after Terra and is lowkey passive aggressive towards Aqua - but can you blame him? Some dark figure came into his room and told him that Terra would change and all, of course he'll want to follow him and try to prevent that.

My most favorite scene in the game is their fight in Radiant Garden - I don't know why. There's just this atmosphere of these three friends who are starting to seperate themselves from one another due to misunderstandings and lies and I actually thought it was somewhat realistic.

 

[catcake]

I like BBS in theory. I like the idea and what it tried to do, I just don't feel it did it well. The combat feels meh, although I do still like it better than the flowmotion&balloonra spam of DDD, and it does have a nice atmosphere at times. I personally never really felt much for TAV, maybe because I just like SRK the most, maybe thanks to KH1 nostalgia, but I just can't reach that same feel for any other trio. But I do think they have potential, and it's not like I dislike them either. One problem not mentioned yet that I had with BBS was bland and boring level design, and I know people say this about DDD, but I have an even bigger problem with BBS worlds. The soundtrack is mediocre, with some really good tracks, but also my least favorite ones from the series.

So all in all, BBS places somewhere in the middle of the list in my KH games ranking. I certainly don't hate it.

 

[Nukara]

Sephiroth0812 , And what exactly was the hidden potential of the game?
I can only agree that it was possible to reveal TAV better. Alas before my favorite trio RAX they could not hold out.
Well, if it's about minuses then in the game the worlds are pretty empty, but then again I think it's just that the PSP does not have enough power. Well, I'm upset that the world has been removed from the game "Jungle Books", but I liked the composition of worlds more than in KH1.
Well, from all the side games, it seems to me that BBS is as close as possible to the number parts. And at least it is not boring. Over the same COM, I sometimes frankly missed. For the story is good, but it's rather tedious to see how Sora walks through the same worlds and white corridors.
As for the BBS, I think it was possible to do something better, but I'm glad that the game came out as it is, and with drawbacks (which have all the games on KH)

 

[DarkGrey Heroine]

I personally like BBS a lot, didn't play the PS3/4 remixes, just the PSP version until I broke my analog stick at my third replay for the third time as Ven on Critical lv1, having done Aqua and Terra two times too each before. You can tell by the amount of time I invested in this game that it was really fun for me, otherwise I wouldn't had come back to it so much. I enjoyed the mechanics, the style changes, lovin' one member of the trio more than the other depending on personal feel to it. Hated Terra's dodge (and many things actually), liked Aqua's Barrier, loved Ven's speed, and so on and on - in the end, the variety BBS offers exists and makes you appreciate certain things more than other based on personal levels of enjoyment of stuff.
In the fandom in and outside the forums we got generally KH1 nostalgia worshippers, KH2 worshipers, and BBS worshippers, if we want to outline where the majorities go. Of course there's the pattern of a more accessible or popular console (or one already known by KH players), that aspect bringing the majorities to play KH1, KH2, BBS back in the days and as of recent years I don't know since almost all games are now on the PS3/4 basically. But I dont give a potion about this. My fav game is DDD on the 3DS, so yeah.
I often found myself not enjoying the writing, then Terra's/Aqua's voice acting, but as for the rest even with secret bosses I felt great going through BBS. And BBS got Ven and Vanitas, I am so glad they exist as characters, really made me connect with KH even more.
...
This "everyone criticizes everything" atmosphere of the internet is really getting out of hand recently...

 

[Nukara]

Well, in my list of favorite games, BBS takes second place after KH2.No I wrote about this above.)
In general, one by one my list is as follows:
Kingdom hearts 2.
Birth by Sleep.
Dream Drop Distance.
358/2 days. (Purely plot, in terms of gameplay the game is worse !!!)
Kingdom hearts.
Chain of Memories.
Coded.

So all in all, BBS places somewhere in the middle of the list in my KH games ranking. I certainly don't hate it.

 

[Nukara]

Yes, I also like Aqua, but do not like her voice in English dubbing.)

I personally like BBS a lot, didn't play the PS3/4 remixes, just the PSP version until I broke my analog stick at my third replay for the third time as Ven on Critical lv1, having done Aqua and Terra two times too each before. You can tell by the amount of time I invested in this game that it was really fun for me, otherwise I wouldn't had come back to it so much. I enjoyed the mechanics, the style changes, lovin' one member of the trio more than the other depending on personal feel to it. Hated Terra's dodge (and many things actually), liked Aqua's Barrier, loved Ven's speed, and so on and on - in the end, the variety BBS offers exists and makes you appreciate certain things more than other based on personal levels of enjoyment of stuff.
In the fandom in and outside the forums we got generally KH1 nostalgia worshippers, KH2 worshipers, and BBS worshippers, if we want to outline where the majorities go. Of course there's the pattern of a more accessible or popular console (or one already known by KH players), that aspect bringing the majorities to play KH1, KH2, BBS back in the days and as of recent years I don't know since almost all games are now on the PS3/4 basically. But I dont give a potion about this. My fav game is DDD on the 3DS, so yeah.
I often found myself not enjoying the writing, then Terra's/Aqua's voice acting, but as for the rest even with secret bosses I felt great going through BBS. And BBS got Ven and Vanitas, I am so glad they exist as characters, really made me connect with KH even more.
...
This "everyone criticizes everything" atmosphere of the internet is really getting out of hand recently...

 

[DarkosOverlord]

Don't mistake the criticism and pointing out flaws of the games for blatant dislike or even hate of the characters or the intended plot though as the true "haters" are indeed a minority among the fanbase, albeit quite a loud one.

This, first and foremost.

On the plot, characters and execution I somewhat agree with everyone else's general idea, with the exception that the flaws and wasted potential the TAV have didn't help in making me like them. I like them as separate characters but as far as trios go SRK is still the only one I really like.
Other than that I do enjoy the plot, and whatever critique I can find and point out, while probably true, doesn't ruin the overall game in my opinion.

On the gameplay I am much harsher, I'm afraid. I am one of those people that think Team Osaka ruined this entire franchise on a gameplay level and that they aren't really capable at doing their jobs.
Opposite to what I've pretty much been told I don't find pleasure in being so vocal about it, but I also can't avoid thinking what BbS could've been with roughly the previous game's formula.
Most of the stuff and characters in BbS I actually LOVE on a conceptual level, but then all the crap the gameplay pulls ruins everything for me. THAT actually dampens my experience.

Moral: on a performance level I can't and won't call BbS a good game, but I still enjoy playing it.

 

[Muke]

On the gameplay I am much harsher, I'm afraid. I am one of those people that think Team Osaka ruined this entire franchise on a gameplay level and that they aren't really capable at doing their jobs.
Opposite to what I've pretty much been told I don't find pleasure in being so vocal about it, but I also can't avoid thinking what BbS could've been with roughly the previous game's formula.
Most of the stuff and characters in BbS I actually LOVE on a conceptual level, but then all the crap the gameplay pulls ruins everything for me. THAT actually dampens my experience.

Pretty much this. Completely agreed

 

[Not Ienzo]

I did like BBS. I liked how they expanded more on Xehanort's past and his overall ambitions for example, the fact that he was from Destiny Islands really surprised me, and it was things like this that made him more interesting as a villain. I liked the lore that was talked about in BBS with the Keyblade War and the X-Blade and such. And come on, you can't tell me that the whole battle with Xehanort was not epic. You just can't. I loved the final bosses of each story as well, especially in Aqua's story.

But while the finale was indeed great, and I loved the ending in general, I feel like the game as a whole was just...less epic than KH1 was (I'm comparing it to that game because they are kinda similar). Like, KH1 truly felt like a journey to save the world and your friend from falling into darkness, and the Heartless were a threat. The Unversed just didn't seem as threatening to me. The premise just wasn't as cool. I did like it though, don't get me wrong. I just think it could have been more of an adventure like KH1 was instead of a squabble in between friends. Like, maybe the Land of Departure could have been destroyed at the beginning like Destiny Islands was. Like many others have said, there could have been more potential.

As for the characters, I do like them as well. I didn't like Terra at first though, since I thought his fall into darkness wasn't his fault, but instead it was the universe actively working against him, unlike with Riku. But now I see it differently and I've started to like his character more. The way I see it is that unlike Riku, he didn't embrace the darkness and outright rejected it. They were both opposites in a way, Riku wanted to delve deeper into the darkness, while Terra wanted to get away from it. Riku was not afraid of the darkness, but in the end he became too confident and let it consume him. Terra was afraid of the darkness and it probably fed the darkness inside him, since he sought power in order to destroy the darkness (even though it can't be destroyed, which of course Eraqus didn't tell Terra). And like I said earlier, Xehanort's ambitions made him more interesting. Like the fact that he was growing old and wanted to expand his lifespan felt very human to me.

As for the gameplay...I had mixed opinions. Combos in general felt really slow and unsatisfying compared to KH1 and KH2. I have the same issue with 3D since it also uses the command deck. Meanwhile you usually can't break out of the enemies combos. With Terra's final boss I had to use counter attacks after each block, and block it's dark balls, and slowly chip away at it's health. I was happy when I beat it, but it just felt way more tedious than it needed to be. I haven't beaten the secret bosses yet (I've only tried VR a few times) so I can't comment on those, but I haven't heard good things about them. And with the command style, I wish they did what they did with the Drive Forms in KH2, where you could select it when you wanted and needed to, giving you strategy and control. Or at the very least, make it so that you're not FORCED to have it. And I just really don't like how enemies don't stagger at all. It feels like you can't even approach a boss at all, not even during it's openings, because they'll just break out of your combos. I did have fun with it though. I enjoyed it. Just not as much as the other games.

This is a minor complaint, but I disliked having to go through the worlds three times with different characters. The plot made me want to continue, since I did enjoy it. But I still found it kinda tedious.

On a positive note though, I REALLY liked the music. Like, a lot. Probably my favorite OST in the series. BBS Dearly Beloved, Dark Impetus, Unbreakable Chains, Dismiss, Keyblade Graveyard, Aqua and Ventus's themes, pretty much all the Disney world themes...oh, and now we're on that topic, I liked the worlds of BBS. I didn't like going through them 3 times. But eh, I found them pretty fun even if they were pointless filler.

TL;DR I enjoyed playing it but there were things about it that I didn't like. Oh and I liked it more than 3D so there's that.

 

[FangirlfromHell]

You are not alone. Birth by Sleep is my favorite of the games. Even with it's flaws (no game is without flaws), of the characters I relate more to Aqua and Terra because they are more mature characters. We get to see them make human mistakes. A lot of times I feel empathy towards the BBS trio. It does however leave me wishing to know even more about them. When did Terra and Aqua start training with the keyblade? What are their home worlds? What circumstances brought Eraqus to them?

Pettily: WHY CAN LINGERING WILL DO ALL THIS BADASS STUFF TERRA COULDN'T?!

 

[Hirokey123]

You can actually do most of what LW does.

-Dark Impulse's regular combo finisher is basically the punching move complete with the slide and gear spin
-His dash attack is just sliding dash except he doesn't have a lag time between uses
-Ultima cannon is a shotlock
-You can use both magnega and blizzaga
-You can't use the whip weapon itself but the whip combo when viewed in slow motion via hacking is actually the Ars Solum command
-The glider is locked to scripted events but it has both the attacks LW did the dash and the flip
-You can't use the bow but Aqua can in her glider form
-You can't lock commands with a bow or staff since enemies don't use commands but you can cast your own variety of magical circles that inflict ailments that can affect enemies like bind and poison which is basically the same thing since all those LW moves did is gimp Sora or put an HP drain on him
-You can't summon drones to lock on and shoot a bunch of bullets at your foes but any ragnarok style shotlock achieves virtually the same thing being a series of shots that fire on all sides intermittently and you're totally invincible during it just as LW is
-You can't do that exact desperation move but that desperation move is for all intents and purposes just a command style, a style that is in the vein of Firestorm and Diamond dust as both have Terra doing that roaring pose as unblockable magic circles around in them in a short but angry aura during their regular finishers. Meanwhile the final strike of his DM move is quite literally just a surge command any surge command simulates it.

Like at the end of the day you pretty much CAN fight like LW just you don't have the fluidity, flash, and i-frames that he has. Of course that's largely due to the way Osaka designs the games, partly due to balance, and partly due to hardware.

 

[FangirlfromHell]

You can actually do most of what LW does.

-Dark Impulse's regular combo finisher is basically the punching move complete with the slide and gear spin
-His dash attack is just sliding dash except he doesn't have a lag time between uses
-Ultima cannon is a shotlock
-You can use both magnega and blizzaga
-You can't use the whip weapon itself but the whip combo when viewed in slow motion via hacking is actually the Ars Solum command
-The glider is locked to scripted events but it has both the attacks LW did the dash and the flip
-You can't use the bow but Aqua can in her glider form
-You can't lock commands with a bow or staff since enemies don't use commands but you can cast your own variety of magical circles that inflict ailments that can affect enemies like bind and poison which is basically the same thing since all those LW moves did is gimp Sora or put an HP drain on him
-You can't summon drones to lock on and shoot a bunch of bullets at your foes but any ragnarok style shotlock achieves virtually the same thing being a series of shots that fire on all sides intermittently and you're totally invincible during it just as LW is
-You can't do that exact desperation move but that desperation move is for all intents and purposes just a command style, a style that is in the vein of Firestorm and Diamond dust as both have Terra doing that roaring pose as unblockable magic circles around in them in a short but angry aura during their regular finishers. Meanwhile the final strike of his DM move is quite literally just a surge command any surge command simulates it.

Like at the end of the day you pretty much CAN fight like LW just you don't have the fluidity, flash, and i-frames that he has. Of course that's largely due to the way Osaka designs the games, partly due to balance, and partly due to hardware.

BLESS YOUR SOUL! You just made my day by taking LW apart so I can actually see what he's really doing! Though you did miss one: Terra cannot use his keyblade like a bow. The rest though: Thank you for making me realize that LW is actually just Lvl.100 Terra XD

 

[ultima-demi]

If Terra had his own solo game that fleshed him out using KH2 gameplay..would have no doubts he would fight like LW or better in general.

It's pretty disappointing though since i think he could have ended up having one of the best fighting styles when you look at LW.

Could easily see him being more enjoyable to play as than Sora. He would have the speed, fluidity and strength of Sora plus more.

Instead he's nerfed hard mainly because of BBS needing 3 separate combat archetypes.

 

[Precursor Mar]

BBS is the dictionary definition of missed potential.
Here you have the foundation laid upon by the excellently crafted KH2FM, as well as the concepts offered by the LW fight and having multiple main characters, only to completely squander it in... well the only way Squeenix can. Keyblade Transformations? We'll just give 'em some cutscenes. Armors? We'll just make 'em glorified space suits. Three playable characters? We'll just make 'em utterly homogenized and give 'em a few superficial differences.

The story is IMO everything bad about KH. Bad characters. Disney being sidelined in favor of the original characters. Constant surface-level talk about friendship. Anime melodrama. Retcons. It's all just so unbearable to watch.

You can actually do most of what LW does.

Starting half of your list with "you can't" kinda defeats your point, though.

BBS Terra only uses two Keyblade Transformations and it's only in minigames, so saying you can fight like him isn't really true.

 

[Theart]

Wow, how times have changed.

BBS was pretty damn popular with members of KHI Forums back when it first came out in 2010/2011. Granted I think a lot of the old regulars from that timeframe have moved on to other stuff and other fans have come around since. Personally speaking, I quite liked BBS. I think it has some noticeable flaws, but that's true of all the Kingdom Hearts games. It's still my second favorite entry of the series, behind the original game.

 

[DarkosOverlord]

Wow, how times have changed.

BBS was pretty damn popular with members of KHI Forums back when it first came out in 2010/2011. Granted I think a lot of the old regulars from that timeframe have moved on to other stuff and other fans have come around since.

I still remember the day I found out a part of the community and especially speedrunners hated BbS (and its sibling titles). It was a bit of a shock, I was still in the stage when I thought every game was more or less good in every way.
It's not that I went only with what they said and lost my own opinion, but as soon as they explained to me about random staggering and all the other flaws I realized what was that weird feeling I felt at times when playing the game: dissatisfaction.

So I was part of the community that simply loved the game, I just was ignorant about some of its bad aspects. I assume it might've been the same for other fans as well.

 

[TelaryCri]

(As an initial statement, I just want Nukara to know that I'm sorry you feel uncomfortable, and what follows is just my one person's opinion, which I honestly don't think is even a very popular one from what I've seen.)

Oh, BBS. The first time I played (or knew anything about what happened in it) the game was when I got the 2.5 HD collection. Up until the I'd replayed KH1, COM, and KH2, and I enjoyed them a lot like I did when I first played them (though I did kinda get a fresh perspective on some of their story/dialogue/character development flaws). I skipped 358/2, because it was just a movie of a side game focused on Roxas and Axel, and I didn't care about them a lot.

Then I finally got to BBS. I played it and, well... I wanted so hard to get on board. To see Master Xehanort as a menacing and interesting overarching villain, to enjoy getting some universe fleshing out, and to connect with a new trio of characters. And, well, I just couldn't.

I tried SO HARD, man. I've played this game through all the way like three times, each time REALLY trying to get further into it than I was initially. But for whatever reason, nothing happened. Xehanort was a generic "blow up the universe guy", I thought the mythology was kinda standard Star Wars knockoff fair, and TAV... I have no idea what it is about these three characters, but try as I might I just don't care about them. And considering the entirety of the game's impact depends on being upset by their fates, the entire game just didn't click for me. I pretty well get why OTHER people have affinity for them, but none of them really spoke to me on a personal level.

And BBS feels to me, in a way I can't quite adequately describe, as sort of a "This is what we're doing now" statement for the overall KH series. It honestly pulled me off the KH train quite a ways. I'm still interested, of course, but that fiery love that I have for the first three (be it simple nostalgia or what have you) just doesn't extend to or beyond this game. But, I've always considered that a fault of mine, rather than others being wrong about it.

I don't necessarily have problems with the gameplay, but I'm not very "hardcore" in that regard so don't take too much of my word for it.

But, in an amusing flip-side of OP's original statement, I feel that I'm rather alienated from the rest of the fanbase given that I DON'T enjoy BBs that much.