The Thirteen Seekers, Revisited

[Smithee]

I'm guessing the 13th Darkness will be "decided" during the game.

Headcanon -- the final Seeker will be Red Skull wielding the Soul Stone. :biggrin:

 

[Michael Mario]

I'm betting on Demyx. It seems weird that he is the only original Organization member to be left out.
Then I'd say Terranort and... I don't know. I'm guessing the 13th Darkness will be "decided" during the game.

See, Demyx the odd man out actually strikes me as perfect because him not even being aware of the "True Organization XIII" sounds like it'd be funny. He's dangerous when he gets serious, but he's so lazy that Xehanort probably opted not to even bother. I'd like a joke like that... while Demyx- or whatever his original name was- still somehow throwing a curveball in either side's plans.

 

[Scary Jeff]

I posted this list back in 2013: https://forums.khinsider.com/kingdom-hearts-iii/177868-13-seats-darkness-2.html#post6038713

So far so good, only two more to be confirmed. Or three if you do not count Terra as confirmed.
I still believe the last two members to be Vexen and Xaldin. The mentioning of those to being unstable is du suspicious to me to be to have no deeper meaning. Ienzo explaining the digital Twilight Town in the new trailer only makes it more clear to me since Even seems to be even more qualified for this scene but is seemingly absend. Demyx just was to nice and never showed any signs of nortification.

Also from what we have know so far the organization members that have been successfully norted were all more stereotypicly evil (see Marluxia, Larxene, Saix) during the events of CoM and KHII. Those two just fit the bill the best.

Replicu was a possibly (but not logical) candidate to me until we saw him in the latest trailer. The missing coat isn't what rules him out for me but the open lack of antagonisim with Riku in that scene.

 

[AmaryllisMoth]

As much as I love Demyx and want him to be relevant somehow I doubt he is going to be a main Nort just because it seems like such an...odd choice for sure.

I would much rather have running into him be just a random surprise in a random world. Like, oh hey...its you. And have him just be...living his life again. Could have some funny dialogue around it, he could run away when he sees you, but ultimately it would be nice to have someone simply be a regular person.

That does still beg the question of why he was recruited in the first place...if he wasn't at least a potential candidate in some form, though...

Welp, no matter his role I hope he isn't just ignored altogether. I'll be pretty upset if EVERYONE is back except for him and we never find out his real name either.

 

[Hallowseve]

I'm sorry but I don't think Demyx is a seeker of darkness. It would be too predictable at this point. We now know that the Organization members in CoM have revived as somebodies or are seekers of darkness. Same with most of the KHII Organization members. I'll be honest, I didn't expect Larxene to be a seeker of darkness, but that's cool. At this point, like I said, I think making Demyx a seeker of darkness would be too predictable. I do believe we should encounter his somebody is some way, shape or form though.

 

[Vasquez]

MX said one of yours is already mine at the end of DDD.

I think Aqua is a true nort.

Still, that resolution would sort of make 0.2 pointless.

 

[Sephiroth0812]

MX said one of yours is already mine at the end of DDD.

I think Aqua is a true nort.

Still, that resolution would sort of make 0.2 pointless.

0.2 Pointless?
Yea no, the last part about involving Aqua in KH 1's ending was pointless but the rest is certainly not as it actually shows the audience how the loneliness and constant exposure to the effects of the Realm of Darkness is affecting Aqua's mental health and resolve, how the defenses of her heart are slowly eroding and the small hope spots she gets "awarded" during its run are crushed shortly afterwards again.

Nomura originally planned the ending to be different and have Aqua break down in tears after she's separated from Mickey and trapped again to show how she's finally reaching her limits after so long.
Aqua is strong but she's no super being, she does have limits too.

To quote myself from another thread for details:

Easily?
The events of BBS itself and an unhealthy long amount spending time trapped in the Realm of Darkness have over time slowly eroded the formidable defenses of Aqua's heart.
Add on top of that in 0.2 she is given several short bouts of hope that are cruelly taken away or crushed a few minutes later, i.e. finally meeting the "real" Terra who managed to project an image to her and a "real" Ventus, who despite being incapacitated subconsciously reached out to her, yet moments later she learns that nothing changed for the better since she fell into the RoD. Ventus is still comatose and hasn't healed yet and even worse, Terra informs her that Xehanort is again after Ventus shortly before Xehanort takes over Terra and thus reveals not only that she right now revealed important info to him in regards to Ven, no she also has to realize that her sacrifice at the end of BBS which made her fall into the RoD in the first place to save Terra was in vain.
He's still trapped in Darkness and tied to Xehanort while Ven is still in danger.

The next hope spot comes when she meets Mickey (who according to the dialogue was led to her indirectly by Terra and Ven) but that too gets crushed when after finding the Kingdom Key D and fighting to shield Riku she ends up trapped again.
Sure, in the very end she gives a brave speech about how she will make the best of the current situation, but that doesn't mean she's not worn down and very exhausted from everything.

When she meets Ansem the Wise in Blank Points she's rather somber and again gets no positive news in regards to Terra and Ven, on the contrary she gets told that the worlds already nearly fell to Darkness more than once and it is only the mention of Sora and what he has done so far that lights up another spark of hope inside her.
That's around the time of Re: Coded, DDD happens afterwards and while I agree we're missing several bouts of context Aqua certainly didn't "easily" fall to the Darkness.

On the contrary it is admirable how long she managed to hang on and resist, but even the strongest hearts have their limits and when one takes a closer look her experiences aren't too different from the whole ordeal Sora was put through in DDD.

I'll drop a quote here that fits this case as well as many others of the original characters:

"The higher up it is dropped, the worse the crash will be. Hope is the best spice to bring out despair."

This applied with enough time and perseverance will eventually break everyone, no matter how strong.
And if Xehanort is anything he's patient and perseverant.

In that thread kirabook also makes some interesting observations on 0.2's role.

Saying in this context that 0.2 is completely pointless I would interpret of not having completely understood what 0.2's point is.

It is not about showing us how "badass" and untouchable Aqua is, but to show more of how human she is and how she's slowly losing her own inner battle and succumbing to the pressure despite prevailing for the time being.

The reveal in KH III now shows the audience now that Aqua's remaining defenses didn't last long enough and Mickey and Riku simply reach her too late.

 

[UltimaXOmega]

LMFAO. I remember when people told me that Luxord,Demyx and Larxene wouldn't return and that Marluxia isn't a Seeker. The only thing I was wrong on was Xion and possibly Terra-Xehanort.

 

[Sephiroth0812]

LMFAO. I remember when people told me that Luxord,Demyx and Larxene wouldn't return and that Marluxia isn't a Seeker. The only thing I was wrong on was Xion and possibly Terra-Xehanort.

So far we have zero information about Xion, Terra, Naminé, Ventus and Roxas in KH III, so anything is theoretically still on the table in terms of theories regarding those characters.

 

[Vasquez]

@Sephiroh0812

The hopeful vibe from blankpoints just seems lost if she's a nort to me. That's just my personal opinion.

But plotwise I understand Nomura probably couldn't have Mickey and Riku accomplish one of their main goals so early in the game AND that Sora will probably be the one to save her ultimately.

 

[Sephiroth0812]

@Sephiroh0812

The hopeful vibe from blankpoints just seems lost if she's a nort to me. That's just my personal opinion.

But plotwise I understand Nomura probably couldn't have Mickey and Riku accomplish one of their main goals so early in the game AND that Sora will probably be the one to save her ultimately.

That is the point we still lack context for though.
Blank Points is the situation furthest in the future we know before "It's too late"- Nortqua and it takes place around Re: Coded, which means the entirety of DDD and the early parts of KH III are missing in terms of coverage on Aqua.

Even in Blank Points itself as I pointed out

When she meets Ansem the Wise in Blank Points she's rather somber and again gets no positive news in regards to Terra and Ven, on the contrary she gets told that the worlds already nearly fell to Darkness more than once and it is only the mention of Sora and what he has done so far that lights up another spark of hope inside her.

Aqua is rather somber and disappointed.
Yea, Ansem the Wise and the mention of Sora manage to ignite another spark of hope but in 0.2 there were also multiple such sparks ignited which then got cruelly dashed again from Aqua's point of view.

It is entirely possible that the same thing happens again between Blank Points and the snippet we saw now of KH III.
That Ansem the Wise doesn't appear to be still with her is also something to take note of.

Aqua being a nort now doesn't mean it has to remain that way either, as 0.2's opening also has a scene where Sora is reaching for Aqua's hand.

Personally spoken, I am not really happy about this development either and also won't be if they decide for story reasons to also prolong Ventus' suffering as I am personally rather fond of all three of the BBS trio and time-wise spoken they're the ones suffering the longest and certainly deserve to finally get some respite, but the central message of Blank Points is that they can be saved and that hasn't changed.

How and when though isn't defined and considering the scale of KH III as a whole and Nomura's hints at many more big reveals there may be more to it than first meets the eye.

 

[Chainofmemories]

Now that i think, Ansem the Wise and Aqua met in the RoD, right?
If Aqua has been "norted" that means Ansem could be a potential Nort too? I mean, they are last seen together laying on the shore and talking about Sora and his heroic doings.

 

[UltimaXOmega]

I'm thinking Terra will be a Light and Aqua and Ventus will be Seekers.

 

[Launchpad]

Xehanort might be straight up piloting Aqua when she addresses Mickey. The yellow eyes AND white hair seem to correlate to a more extreme level of control, no?

 

[Graceful Schemer]

Another point to consider is Braig. Braig and Xigbar have physical differences, so we know that the one running around is Xigbar. Where is Braig then? He is a Xehanort, but is he a Seeker? The same is with Saix/Isa we saw in DDD. If it is Saix, where is Isa? The same question would also apply to any other members, are they the Nobodies here through time-travel or are they the Re-completed Somebodies? If they are the Nobodies, where are their Somebodies? If they are the Somebodies, why not just use their Nobodies as well?

For someone who wants the battle to happen, Xehanort sure likes to take people from the Light side.

Considering all these questions and the number of potential seekers are starting to be way over 13. From the interview, at least 9 proper Disney Worlds seem likely (by proper, I mean not Mini-Game-based like 100 Acre Wood), there is one Seeker who has not appeared in any World yet and one un-shown confirmed World and there are four Seekers who may not take control of a Disney World (Master Xehanort, Ansem, Xemnas, and the 13th).

 

[Alpha Baymax]

I'm thinking Terra will be a Light and Aqua and Ventus will be Seekers.

Well, what if Terranort is not a Seeker of Darkness because Ansem and Xemnas are more wholly-realised Xehanort variants?

Did Terranort ever have the pointed ears? Because if he didn't, time travel shenanigans could occur that makes Terra a Guardian of Light (his Lingering Will can technically time travel because it's discarded its body).

 

[Zettaflare]

Would Atlantis be a good fit for Aqua? Her name does translate to water.

 

[ImVentus]

It would be hilarious if Elsa was a member.

 

[Megavoltage]

0.2 Pointless?
Yea no, the last part about involving Aqua in KH 1's ending was pointless but the rest is certainly not as it actually shows the audience how the loneliness and constant exposure to the effects of the Realm of Darkness is affecting Aqua's mental health and resolve, how the defenses of her heart are slowly eroding and the small hope spots she gets "awarded" during its run are crushed shortly afterwards again.

My emotions on the subject have been flip flopping. I don’t know what to think about 0.2 now, or the Aquanort situation. Maybe Aqua will get a character arc from this and the Aquanort situation will be worth it, who knows. But I’m still annoyed.

A part of the anger is because the Wayfinder trio have been stuck both figuratively and literally in a stasis since 2010. Birth by Sleep? The trio fail, they’re now suffering and waiting to be saved. Birth by Sleep Final Mix’s Secret Episode? The trio are suffering and need to be saved. Recoded? The trio are still suffering and need to be saved. Dream Drop Distance? The trio are still suffering and need to be saved. 0.2? A brand new engine but nothing new for the characters to do, the trio are still suffering and need to be saved. It’s monotonous at this point! Do something new with these characters. And now because of Aquanort it looks like the Wayfinder trio sit out a lot, if not most, of Kingdom Hearts 3 as a suffering trio that need to be saved. No new fun interactions with the other characters, no high adventure, no getting comeuppance against Master Xehanort. Just suffering and needing to be saved since 2010. Monotonous.

 

[Sephiroth0812]

My emotions on the subject have been flip flopping. I don’t know what to think about 0.2 now, or the Aquanort situation. Maybe Aqua will get a character arc from this and the Aquanort situation will be worth it, who knows. But I’m still annoyed.

A part of the anger is because the Wayfinder trio have been stuck both figuratively and literally in a stasis since 2010. Birth by Sleep? The trio fail, they’re now suffering and waiting to be saved. Birth by Sleep Final Mix’s Secret Episode? The trio are suffering and need to be saved. Recoded? The trio are still suffering and need to be saved. Dream Drop Distance? The trio are still suffering and need to be saved. 0.2? A brand new engine but nothing new for the characters to do, the trio are still suffering and need to be saved. It’s monotonous at this point! Do something new with these characters. And now because of Aquanort it looks like the Wayfinder trio sit out a lot, if not most, of Kingdom Hearts 3 as a suffering trio that need to be saved. No new fun interactions with the other characters, no high adventure, no getting comeuppance against Master Xehanort. Just suffering and needing to be saved since 2010. Monotonous.

Oh, do not mistake my elaboration on how it all makes narrative sense for actually liking or applauding this decision.

In terms of personal opinion, I am actually fully in line with your assessment regarding the BBS trio as Terra, Aqua and Ventus are indeed those out of the wider major original cast who are suffering the longest and continuing this status throughout most of KH III just for more drama points would certainly be a big letdown for me and a huge continuous waste of their characters.

The prospect of them finally interacting with the other characters is very enticing and ripe for all kinds of rewarding stuff, from comedic, heartrending and badass back to back fighting right up finally actually showing the supposed close bonds and friendship, both among them and the other "trios" and each other.

Seriously, I've wanted an actual meeting between Sora and Ventus and some exploration of their supposed "special close" heart bond since BBS was new and a follow up to Aqua meeting kid-Riku and Sora is also on the Agenda.

Getting comeuppance against the old fart would only be the cherry on top of the other stuff.