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The plot.



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What are your thoughts concerning the change of tide the series' story has taken? More specifically, Master Xehanort's plan? His machination of utilizing various iterations of himself to instigate a Keyblade War no matter what to reach his goal; Kingdom Hearts?

So again;
What are your honest thoughts towards the tides the Saga's narrative is taking.

In my opinion, I'm not liking the thought of all these Xehanorts appearing. =/ It's just makes all of them, suddenly, almost artificial, like MX has a a do-them-yourself Xehanort generating machine.

Seriously, I've never been irked by plot-point in KH before, but this has taken my attention (and not in a good way). =/

In summation;
I just want this Chronicle to end so they can try something new already.
 

Seighart

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Well to me, i like that its getting to a serious point and not dragging us on anymore. What i'm worried about is if the main plot of the games...are going to be to obtain Kingdom Hearts. Going back on topic, i like that some guy is trying to act omnipotent and creating copies of himself. I only like it because i'm hoping we aren't getting EXACT copies, just people that share characteristics of Xehanort.
 

Hillboy

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What about plot?
(Sorry I had to)
131742038104-plot_-_the_real_reas.png


But, seriously... I like where the story has headed. There was a bit too much retconing, but I didn't think it was too bad. I think the way it leads up to Kh3 and it seems to set up an epic senario for KH3. I love me my epic final battles
 

WaveK89

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Actually, it makes me wonder how Kingdom Hearts (actual, not the game series) will tie in after the Xehanort saga is done with considering it's becoming a more prominent focus so far in the series...mainly by Xehanort
 

D.D.D

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Honestly? I'm more excited for KH3 than ever.
I love the direction the series has taken. There's so many twists and turns that the story could follow now. I thought the time traveling was a little strange, but it doesn't bother me all that much just because it's a limited kind of time travel.
At first when Lea got a Keyblade, I was a little annoyed, just because it seems that everyone in the series is getting a Keyblade. Heck, Goofy and Donald are probably up next (I hope not). But then I accepted it and actually thought it was kinda cool.
Then again, I'm a very easily pleased fan, so really almost anything that will happen in KH I'll be okay with.
To the OP about MX and his plan, well, I absolutely love the idea. It just seems that MX is always one jump ahead of the main gang, and he's my personal favorite villain of all time.
 

Vani

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I'm really not sure what to think. I think the plot has potential to be something interesting but only if handled correctly.
 

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I'm really not sure what to think. I think the plot has potential to be something interesting but only if handled correctly.

My thoughts exactly. The retcons were as much of a massacre as Californian serial killers. They're actually handling the narrative and focus well, but with the cost of some things.
 

Smithee

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With the way the story's going, the whole "Darkness isn't evil" thing seems to have been shot down by the "7 Lights = good guys, 13 Darknesses = bad guys" deal. It looks like MX is only proving Eraqus right about Darkness more and more.

Hopefully we'll get a Light-based enemy to counteract that.
 
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I mean, I don't mind the plot, they have set it up very well with little hints here and there that you pick up after knowing what's actually happening. But my issue is with Xehanort's reasoning. I find it very peculiar that Xehanort knows that 7 lights and 13 darknesses need to clash and he is very confident that 1 of the lights is on his side. Xehanort wants the lights to clash with the darknesses, so why would he want lights on his side? That would just screw with the numbers and his plan. I mean, I suppose you could say that Lea and Kairi could fill in for Sora and Terra as lights, but Xehanort obviously didn't know about them, hence Lea's interference with Sora's Nortification. Meh. I don't know. Something just doesn't add up there.

Either way though, I love the game, I love the plot, and I love how it's a mind kupo. :D
 

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With the way the story's going, the whole "Darkness isn't evil" thing seems to have been shot down by the "7 Lights = good guys, 13 Darknesses = bad guys" deal. It looks like MX is only proving Eraqus right about Darkness more and more.
Uh... No it doesn't, lol. It all goes down to how Master Xehanort is utilizing every means possible to get a hold of various incarnations of himself to orchestrate another Keyblade War, obtain the Xblade, Kingdom Hearts and bring an eternal equilibrium between light and dark.

In summation;
It's an anti-hero getting more and more violent, not that darkness is becoming evil. =/

Hopefully we'll get a Light-based enemy to counteract that.
We've had enemies that represent the Realm of Darkness (Heartless), Realm of the In-Between (Nobodies), Realm of Sleep (Dream Eaters/Spirits/Nightmares) and no realm at all (Unversed). The last to represent any realm are creatures of the Realm of Light. Maybe they were sealed somewhere and Xehanort unleashed them to mess with the Princesses' worlds to get a reaction from the heroes?

I mean, I don't mind the plot, they have set it up very well with little hints here and there that you pick up after knowing what's actually happening. But my issue is with Xehanort's reasoning. I find it very peculiar that Xehanort knows that 7 lights and 13 darknesses need to clash and he is very confident that 1 of the lights is on his side. Xehanort wants the lights to clash with the darknesses, so why would he want lights on his side? That would just screw with the numbers and his plan. I mean, I suppose you could say that Lea and Kairi could fill in for Sora and Terra as lights, but Xehanort obviously didn't know about them, hence Lea's interference with Sora's Nortification. Meh. I don't know. Something just doesn't add up there.
Uh... The Seven Lights are presumed to be Master Aqua, Master Riku, Sora, Kairi, Lea, Ventus, and Master Mickey. Both Riku and Sora were considered to occupy the 13th chair on the Xehanorganization, both are now irrelevant. Riku because he built a strong resistance against darkness and Sora because, after all the trouble they went to force him in, they decided to quit. There is no one in the Light side that Master Xehanort wants, on the contrary, he wanted. And if you're thinking Ven so he can get the Xblade, which should answer your following question, then this is the case;

There are TWO scenarios by in getting the Xblade:

+ A heart of pure light and another of pure darkness unite.
+ A clash between keyblade wielders of light and dark happens (Keyblade War).

Xehanort is doing all these to recreate a Keyblade War so he can get the Xblade, summon KH and become an all powerful being to shape the world to his ideals (a balance between light and dark). He's like an anti-hero becoming a heroic dictator.

That's the Xehanort Saga in a nutshell;
An anti-hero that wants to become a God, play A HELL LOT OF GAMES to progress and finalize the plot.

That's also the series in a nutshell;
Play these ridiculously-fantastic games (ridiculous-plot, fantastic-gameplay) to progress and finalize the series' story by playing various games available on various consoles! :]
 

Nayru's Love

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It's going to be interesting when MX watches as his years-on-end planning is ruined by KH logic, which will probably equate to something stupidly simple. It's like level-grinding your Mewtwo all the way to lvl 100, only to watch it lose to a lvl 1 FEAR Rattata.
 

Sephiroth0812

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With the way the story's going, the whole "Darkness isn't evil" thing seems to have been shot down by the "7 Lights = good guys, 13 Darknesses = bad guys" deal. It looks like MX is only proving Eraqus right about Darkness more and more.

Hopefully we'll get a Light-based enemy to counteract that.

I seriously don't know what is always your issue with "darkness isn't evil", that was never said anywhere in the series. The only thing said was that darkness is a part of nature like light is and in the end, both are only elements and sources of power.
The darkness itself also is rarely ever the problem but those who abuse it for destructive purposes due to the properties darkness holds as an element, namely consuming and corrupting effects.
Xehanort and the 13 seekers of darkness aren't "evil" because they use darkness, they are "evil" because for what they want to use the darkness for (namely destroying the universe).

I just have one question, and I'm sorry if this has been asked before, but why did MX want Sora in the Xehanorganization so badly?

I don't think that has been asked already, but MX wasn't as "hellbent" on getting Sora at first as some people seem to suggest here. The new Organisation also still had not completely given up on Riku.
It was only when Riku reached Symphony of Sorcery (when he met Young MX at the Bald Mountain) that they realized Riku's resistance to darkness had become so strong it was impossible to turn him over.

From what we learned through Young MX's explanations, they first had their eyes on Riku, then on Roxas, but he became too independent and was then useless as a vessel for Xehanort and so they finally settled on Sora.

As for exactly why except that their initial choices didn't work I don't think there was any explanation given, but I could imagine that it may have to do with Sora's special ability to connect to so many hearts. It is, after all, very similar to Xehanort's own ability, although it's used completely different.

EDIT:
It's going to be interesting when MX watches as his years-on-end planning is ruined by KH logic, which will probably equate to something stupidly simple. It's like level-grinding your Mewtwo all the way to lvl 100, only to watch it lose to a lvl 1 FEAR Rattata.

I'm calling it now, MX is going to end up just like Palpatine, decades of planning and screwing over people and then one or two little actions by Sora and those connected to him he didn't count on make his whole web of intertwined schemes blow up in his face. *ggg*
 

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As for exactly why except that their initial choices didn't work I don't think there was any explanation given, but I could imagine that it may have to do with Sora's special ability to connect to so many hearts. It is, after all, very similar to Xehanort's own ability, although it's used completely different.

It's weird to think that Sora and MX are the only ones in the series whose hearts have such a strong effect on others. Sora's reaches out to others to help and MX's poisons others and is like a parasite. This makes me wonder... are Sora and MX related somehow? Not family-wise, I mean, because family doesn't have any importance in KH. Like, why are they the only ones with that power? I also wonder if Nomura is going to highlight that connection between them in the future.
 

Smithee

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I seriously don't know what is always your issue with "darkness isn't evil", that was never said anywhere in the series. The only thing said was that darkness is a part of nature like light is and in the end, both are only elements and sources of power.
The darkness itself also is rarely ever the problem but those who abuse it for destructive purposes due to the properties darkness holds as an element, namely consuming and corrupting effects.
Xehanort and the 13 seekers of darkness aren't "evil" because they use darkness, they are "evil" because for what they want to use the darkness for (namely destroying the universe).

You do realize you just explained exactly what I'm talking about, don't you?
 

Seighart

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Actually, it makes me wonder how Kingdom Hearts (actual, not the game series) will tie in after the Xehanort saga is done with considering it's becoming a more prominent focus so far in the series...mainly by Xehanort


yeah thats basically what i was thinking...
 

Hillboy

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It's weird to think that Sora and MX are the only ones in the series whose hearts have such a strong effect on others. Sora's reaches out to others to help and MX's poisons others and is like a parasite. This makes me wonder... are Sora and MX related somehow? Not family-wise, I mean, because family doesn't have any importance in KH. Like, why are they the only ones with that power? I also wonder if Nomura is going to highlight that connection between them in the future.

Well that's the difference between a protagonist and an antagonist. The antagonist always has the moral opposite of the protagonist, and MX is very opposite they way he uses his power to connect with others
 

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Hm, what does everyone mean by the "retconning"? The only thing I can think of that was "retconned" was that Nobodies can actually grow hearts over time I guess. But that wasn't really a retcon since they still don't have them initially...Xemnas just never told them it was possible for them to get them back. Which makes sense since Days showed that Xemnas was just completely using the entire Organization anyway. And they hinted at the fact that Nobodies could have hearts for a while now. It was obvious Roxas had a heart, but then in Days we got to see that Axel seemed to grow one, too. So I dunno, I wouldn't exactly call it a "retcon." Just outright saying something that has been subtly hinted at for a while now :p
 

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I agree, there really wasn't any retconing. They just added more to the cannon that we didn't know about
 

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Hm, what does everyone mean by the "retconning"?
The "retcon" I detected was Xemnas, look:

KINGDOM HEARTS II stated that Xemnas formed Organization XIII to facilitate his look for Kingdom Hearts to get a heart of his own and for others. Final Mix+ revealed that he actually had another thing in mind. In the reports he wrote in 358/2 Days, he revealed that he was actually using ALL OF THEM to become a bigger existence to create a world to his binding (this was mentioned in II, but it was less important than getting a heart). Now it's revealed in this game that he formed the Organization to look for potential body hosts to Xehanort heart pieces to start a Keyblade War.

At the beginning, it's just a small problem with the shifting of importance;
+ In KH2, Xemnas gave more importance to finding a heart. It didn't seem he was using his Nobody lackies, but his attitude was more like "Do what you need to do even if you die".

+ Now this shifted in Days, when he revealed through reports that he actually wanted the powers of Kingdom Hearts, not to get a heart of his own, but to creating a world according to his ideals.

Taking all this in mind, the fact he knew that, over time, a Nobody may create a heart was a sort of scapegoat to subtly retcon the hell out of Xemnas' initial goals (getting a heart/creating an ideal world). I'm complaining because Xemnas is a cool character and one of my favorites, but now it feels as though he is waaay less than Master Xehanort (even though, obviously, he is, but it kinda ruined his character, at least to me, but only a bit).

The only thing I can think of that was "retconned" was that Nobodies can actually grow hearts over time I guess.
I wouldn't necessarily say retcon, but more like introduced late and poorly.

Just outright saying something that has been subtly hinted at for a while now :p
Roxas case was special, seeing as how he had Ventus' heart. Meanwhile, Axel could be said that he just developed emotion or remembered them, so a hint isn't that obvious.

I agree, there really wasn't any retconing. They just added more to the cannon that we didn't know about

Late and poorly, but they did.
 
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