Why is there a chosen one?

[Dawn Rebirth]

Well I always thought that heartless is darkness manifested into a form or shape which: 1) is not considered a body/vessel and 2) Meaning that they aren't actually alive. Also are you saying that anyone with some kind of significant power can restore or replace or recreate a soul?

It is.

1. Didn't say it was or had a vessel. I said she could have made a new one, if she didn't reshape the darkness. Once again, I don't know much about what Kairi did to turn Sora back into his original self. Only that it had something to do with her memory of him.

2. I would say there's more to being alive, than just being able to move around.

3. 'Replace' sounds about right. If the soul works like a battery. Perhaps it works more like a rechargable battery.

 

[Sephiroth0812]

Okay then, answer me this. What happened to the two KKs Roxas was weilding? For that matter, if KK is only Sora's (But was originally Riku's) then why is Ven's Keyblade seen with one? Neither of these blades are fake, and if Wayward Wind is the base for Ven's Keyblade, then why wasn't it on Ven's Keyblade when Roxas summoned it?

That still doesn't indicate every keyblade looking like the KK at the base at all. Roxas is born from Sora, and the memories of the base keyblade he has is Sora's (Riku's old one), so it's only natural even the second keyblade looks like his base one first. They were also only like this for a split second and then changed into Oblivion and Oathkeeper, which are more or less Roxas's "base".

That Ven's keyblade didn't look like Wayward Wind is easily explainable by neither Sora or Roxas having memories how Ven's base blade looks like, but the KK, base of Sora's they do have memories of.

That said, I also still fail to see why you make such a big deal about that. It's only logical that if there are as many keyblades as qualified hearts there would be also as many "base" blades.
Having every keyblade looking the same at the core just doesn't make sense.

I know the battle took place within Sora's heart which would make sense for why Roxas could use Sora's keyblade at the same time as Sora but there is a large gap between where Roxas leaves Sora in TT and Roxas fighting Sora in Sora's heart in which surely Roxas used his keyblades and therefore Sora's keyblade at the same time Sora was using it. I am aware that we do not know what happened to Roxas during this gap and therefore there is no actual proof that Roxas used his keyblades but it seems very unlikely that he wouldn't because it was a big gap. Also what do you mean Roxas was already inside Sora cause I thought he didn't rejoin with Sora until before the Xemnas battle (unless are you just saying that during the fight Roxas was inside Sora?)

When does Roxas ever leave Sora in TT? o_0
After the "my summer vacation is over"-line Roxas was inside Sora all the time. They did already rejoin at the end of the Prologue of KH2.
The only difference between them rejoining and the half-transparent scene before the last Xemnas-battle is that Roxas didn't accept Sora as his other and actively resisted from within Sora. It's like with Ven resisting the fusion with Vanitas causing the X-blade to be incomplete, Roxas did rejoin with Sora, but not fully due to him resisting until after their fight.
He didn't want to join with Sora, he was forced to and even hated Sora for a while because Roxas's biggest wish at all times was to have an own life for himself.
After their fight at the station of awakening Roxas finally came to accept Sora and also his fate because it wasn't changeable anyways.
That's also why Final Form is unlocked then: Roxas stopped resisting at that point and denying Sora access to his half of Sora's power.

Also, due to Roxas's and Sora's special connection they can always both use the same keyblade at the same time. It can exist in multiple places at once.

 

[Dawn Rebirth]

That still doesn't indicate every keyblade looking like the KK at the base at all. Roxas is born from Sora, and the memories of the base keyblade he has is Sora's (Riku's old one), so it's only natural even the second keyblade looks like his base one first. They were also only like this for a split second and then changed into Oblivion and Oathkeeper, which are more or less Roxas's "base".

That Ven's keyblade didn't look like Wayward Wind is easily explainable by neither Sora or Roxas having memories how Ven's base blade looks like, but the KK, base of Sora's they do have memories of.

That said, I also still fail to see why you make such a big deal about that. It's only logical that if there are as many keyblades as qualified hearts there would be also as many "base" blades.

Having every keyblade looking the same at the core just doesn't make sense.

Roxas and Sora are the same person, Roxas is practically an alter-ego of Sora's. Thus, how can Roxas have his own base(s) when he's the same person as Sora?

My belief is that KK or KK-D are dormant memories of existence for their weilder. Thus, it's not really they're the same at the core, but on the surface (Remember, Numora said Sora and Mickey obtained the Keyblades of the light and dark sides of the heart of worlds. KK and KK-D are Keychains). But, I fully understand there can be different Keyblades and Keychains, and as many as there are 'qualified hearts' in the KH universe.

What I fail to understand is the complete definition of 'bases' and what they allow. It seems to have to do with how many places the same Keyblade can exist at one time and it also is based on memories. But, that's as far as I can see. Anything else is not currently within my grasp of knowledge. Though it doesn't mean I can't understand an explaination.

 

[Sephiroth0812]

Roxas and Sora are the same person, Roxas is practically an alter-ego of Sora's. Thus, how can Roxas have his own base(s) when he's the same person as Sora?

My belief is that KK or KK-D are dormant memories of existence for their weilder. Thus, it's not really they're the same at the core, but on the surface (Remember, Numora said Sora and Mickey obtained the Keyblades of the light and dark sides of the heart of worlds. KK and KK-D are Keychains). But, I fully understand there can be different Keyblades and Keychains, and as many as there are 'qualified hearts' in the KH universe.

What I fail to understand is the complete definition of 'bases' and what they allow. It seems to have to do with how many places the same Keyblade can exist at one time and it also is based on memories. But, that's as far as I can see. Anything else is not currently within my grasp of knowledge. Though it doesn't mean I can't understand an explaination.

Roxas and Sora are NOT the same person, nobodies and somebodies aren't the same. With Roxas there comes on top that he is a special being as well that he is a hybrid of two persons.
There's a reason Roxas doesn't like being compared with Sora all the time.
Roxas started out absolutely blank and developed into something new because Kairi already restored Sora.
If we go exactly nitpicky Roxas doesn't even have his own keyblades however because he always used Sora's because that is where he originally came from. He was born from Sora's heart, and that heart's keyblade looks like the KK.

That sentence you'll have to explain now though because I don't understand it.
Sora's and Mickey's keyblades aren't any special compared to Terra's, MX's, Ven's or Aqua's, they're all simply keyblades of the realm of light. They're of the same type.
Kingdom Key D is a keyblade originating from the RoD, but that is the only dfference to the others, it's point of origin. Otherwise, KK-D, KK, Wayward Wind, Earthshaker, Rainfell and MX's keyblade have all exactly the same abilities.

I don't even know where this "bases" talk came from in the first place...all I see now is some weird discussion about every keyblade looking like the KK which doesn't make sense in the series overall mythology at all.
Every keyblade allows the same stuff except the X-blade and the KoPH, because those belong to a different category.

 

[LegendaryHeroLCB]

Alright, after all of this, one question (in my opinion) carries the most weight. What exactly is a true Keyblade? Throughout the whole Kingdom Hearts series, almost all Keyblades shown are Keychains. Keychains (correct me if I'm wrong) are pretty much an add-on if you will of the Keyblade that give it special powers depending on what the Keychain has. Gears (also correct me if I'm wrong) are another form of...a keychain...thing? Anyway, the only thing that is a Keyblade that hasn't been confirmed as a Keychain is that Keyblade used by Riku (when he was possessed by Xehanort's Heartless). So then, do keychains choose rather than keyblades?

 

[Dawn Rebirth]

Roxas and Sora are NOT the same person, nobodies and somebodies aren't the same. With Roxas there comes on top that he is a special being as well that he is a hybrid of two persons.
There's a reason Roxas doesn't like being compared with Sora all the time.
Roxas started out absolutely blank and developed into something new because Kairi already restored Sora.
If we go exactly nitpicky Roxas doesn't even have his own keyblades however because he always used Sora's because that is where he originally came from. He was born from Sora's heart, and that heart's keyblade looks like the KK.

That sentence you'll have to explain now though because I don't understand it.
Sora's and Mickey's keyblades aren't any special compared to Terra's, MX's, Ven's or Aqua's, they're all simply keyblades of the realm of light. They're of the same type.
Kingdom Key D is a keyblade originating from the RoD, but that is the only dfference to the others, it's point of origin. Otherwise, KK-D, KK, Wayward Wind, Earthshaker, Rainfell and MX's keyblade have all exactly the same abilities.

I don't even know where this "bases" talk came from in the first place...all I see now is some weird discussion about every keyblade looking like the KK which doesn't make sense in the series overall mythology at all.
Every keyblade allows the same stuff except the X-blade and the KoPH, because those belong to a different category.

Roxas is Sora's body and soul. Roxas is 2/3 of Sora. Aside from Ventus' crippled heart changing his form into that of Ventus and having said heart for most of his existence (Not going to get into whether Roxas exists or not), he's practically an alter-ego of Sora's. Roxas wants to be his own person, that's why he doesn't like being compared with Sora. But if he knew of Ventus he wouldn't want to be compared to him. Roxas isn't the same person as Ventus, but he is 2/3 of Sora. A nobody is a part of someone, Roxas is a part of one person. That Person is Sora.

On the surface every Keychain is either a KK or KK-D. These are dormant memories as that is what Keychains are. In KH1 Sora recieved Keychains from other people, instead of just finding them. Ex: Three Wishes=Created when Aladdin met Genie. Once a person finds themself said Keychain awakens. (Going by what you said) Ven's transformed into Oathkeeper and Sora's tranformed Oblivion. The relevence of time is that it takes time for the dormant memory to awaken. Ven's originally turned into Wayward, but had to restart when Roxas summoned it then reawakened it into Oathkeeper. Basically what I'm trying to say is that my theory is Vanitas, MX, M.E. , Mickey, Aqua, and Terra's Keychains had already awakened by the time of BBS. If Vanitas had summoned his Keyblade right after being plucked out of Ven's heart and it was Void Gear than that would proof against it. But there are no first time summons that can disprove it. Seeing as each first time summon was using the same Keyblade. Also note that Mickey's Keychain: Star Seeker is given to Sora, yet it's supposed to be only Mic's Keychain. Now if you want to assume that Mickey switched-out the Keychains so Sora could use it in KH2 and then switched-out the two (Keychain) for Coded, be my guest.

Let me get this straight, you used something that you don't know as a way to win the discussion? For the record, I'm saying all STARTER KEYCHAINS look one of two ways on the surface. When they awaken they turn into something different. Keychains made from other memories will often be unique, but Oathkeeper, Oblivion, and Ultima Weapon are some of the few or many exceptions.

I have uncovered the Keyblade's ultimate mystery. You see, besides the three families of Keyblades, there is another "Key Blade." While it may sound the same when spoken, it is notated uniquely: "χ-blade." And make no mistake, while it resembles a normal Keyblade, it is something altogether different.Keyblades are said to be man-made counterparts to Kingdom Hearts. The χ-blade, however, coexists with Kingdom Hearts.

X-Blade or Death-Blade is not a Keyblade, nor is it a type of one (Not that it's relevent to the discussion).

Alright, after all of this, one question (in my opinion) carries the most weight. What exactly is a true Keyblade? Throughout the whole Kingdom Hearts series, almost all Keyblades shown are Keychains. Keychains (correct me if I'm wrong) are pretty much an add-on if you will of the Keyblade that give it special powers depending on what the Keychain has. Gears (also correct me if I'm wrong) are another form of...a keychain...thing? Anyway, the only thing that is a Keyblade that hasn't been confirmed as a Keychain is that Keyblade used by Riku (when he was possessed by Xehanort's Heartless). So then, do keychains choose rather than keyblades?

In the report above ^ Xehanort reffers to the Keyblade being possibly a man-made counterparts of KH (Which kinda begs the question how if this is true). They represent memories, as if Keyblades really are supposed to mirror Kingdom Hearts then Memory may or may not be essential. But if we take Marluxia's words about Sora's heart being destroyed, it basically implies the Memory which these Keychains represent stabalize a Keyblade. Thus a Keyblade such as HO/KoPH is unstable, perhaps this could explain why it's able to unlock people's hearts in dangerous manner. However, the Death-Blade coexists with KH and has a Keychain of it's own, though perhaps that's one thing that seperates a Keyblade from the Death-Blade (It works without any draw-backs).

Seeing as Nobodies are so into artifical things (Replicas to name one) it wouldn't be hard to believe that Gears are artifical Keychains. However, that's more of shot in the dark, if not one with a few lit lamps to guide the way.

HO does/did not possess a Keychain

Not so sure a memory alone can choose, but who knows.

 

[Sephiroth0812]

Roxas is Sora's body and soul. Roxas is 2/3 of Sora. Aside from Ventus' crippled heart changing his form into that of Ventus and having said heart for most of his existence (Not going to get into whether Roxas exists or not), he's practically an alter-ego of Sora's. Roxas wants to be his own person, that's why he doesn't like being compared with Sora. But if he knew of Ventus he wouldn't want to be compared to him. Roxas isn't the same person as Ventus, but he is 2/3 of Sora. A nobody is a part of someone, Roxas is a part of one person. That Person is Sora.

To be specific: Roxas uses Sora's body and soul as his physical presence. His own memories and mind/spirit/sense of self (or whatever you want to call it) are what Roxas himself is.
Ven's heart gave him more than just looks actually, as there was the ability to feel for real. Nobodies do exist, they can interact and develop on their own, the "don't exist" part only comes from the broader defintion of in-universe laws which they don't abide by.
See, and on that we're actually on the same boat, Roxas wouldn't want to be compared to Ven, but he also doesn't want to be compared to Sora.
Mix different things together and you get something new, which is exactly what Roxas was during his short physical existence.

On the surface every Keychain is either a KK or KK-D. These are dormant memories as that is what Keychains are. In KH1 Sora recieved Keychains from other people, instead of just finding them. Ex: Three Wishes=Created when Aladdin met Genie. Once a person finds themself said Keychain awakens. (Going by what you said) Ven's transformed into Oathkeeper and Sora's tranformed Oblivion. The relevence of time is that it takes time for the dormant memory to awaken. Ven's originally turned into Wayward, but had to restart when Roxas summoned it then reawakened it into Oathkeeper. Basically what I'm trying to say is that my theory is Vanitas, MX, M.E. , Mickey, Aqua, and Terra's Keychains had already awakened by the time of BBS. If Vanitas had summoned his Keyblade right after being plucked out of Ven's heart and it was Void Gear than that would proof against it. But there are no first time summons that can disprove it. Seeing as each first time summon was using the same Keyblade. Also note that Mickey's Keychain: Star Seeker is given to Sora, yet it's supposed to be only Mic's Keychain. Now if you want to assume that Mickey switched-out the Keychains so Sora could use it in KH2 and then switched-out the two (Keychain) for Coded, be my guest.

Where did you get that bolded part from? That is neither hinted nor anywhere plausible anywhere in the series.
Keychains aren't "dormant" memories, keychains are additions crafted for a keyblade either by people (in KH1) or by worlds (KH2, with the exception of Fenrir). The first (or "base") keychain (which is at the same time the default look of said keyblade) is crafted the first time the wielder awakens his/her keyblade, making that one the "base" keychain for the blade.
With Terra, this is the Earthshaker, with Aqua, it is the Rainfell, Ven the Wayward Wind, Riku the Way to Dawn and Sora the KK, there is no reason to suddenly think that every keyblade looks the same at the beginning.
Keychains don't get awakened, they get created by memories and connections between people/worlds. When TAV, Vanitas or anyone received their blades they created their personal base "keychain" for it, adding a step between just overcomplicates things.

Let me get this straight, you used something that you don't know as a way to win the discussion? For the record, I'm saying all STARTER KEYCHAINS look one of two ways on the surface. When they awaken they turn into something different. Keychains made from other memories will often be unique, but Oathkeeper, Oblivion, and Ultima Weapon are some of the few or many exceptions.

No, I said I don't know why there is such a fuss made about it ("bases" talk) as it was already clear that every keyblade is unique. You make it sound as if the KK and KKD-keychains are something special which they aren't, the KK is just the default keychain of Sora's blade and the KKD is the keychain of one blade from the RoD.
There exists absolutely no evidence/suggestion to this being different as "Starter keychains" as you called them take their unique form directly according to the heart of their wielders.
The KK IS Sora's starter keychain, that's why he uses it most of times.

X-Blade or Death-Blade is not a Keyblade, nor is it a type of one (Not that it's relevent to the discussion).

The X-Blade is not a "normal" keyblade, but that's also why I put it outside the three "normal" categories. It stands uniquely on its own as the ultimate weapon, but is still a keyblade since its the key to Kingdom Hearts directly.

EDIT:
The reason the KoPH had no keychain is pretty simple and has nothing to do with memories: It was incimplete due to Kairi's heart missing.
To be complete that keyblade needs the hearts of all seven princesses.

 

[LegendaryHeroLCB]

Roxas is Sora's body and soul. Roxas is 2/3 of Sora. Aside from Ventus' crippled heart changing his form into that of Ventus and having said heart for most of his existence (Not going to get into whether Roxas exists or not), he's practically an alter-ego of Sora's. Roxas wants to be his own person, that's why he doesn't like being compared with Sora. But if he knew of Ventus he wouldn't want to be compared to him. Roxas isn't the same person as Ventus, but he is 2/3 of Sora. A nobody is a part of someone, Roxas is a part of one person. That Person is Sora.

On the surface every Keychain is either a KK or KK-D. These are dormant memories as that is what Keychains are. In KH1 Sora recieved Keychains from other people, instead of just finding them. Ex: Three Wishes=Created when Aladdin met Genie. Once a person finds themself said Keychain awakens. (Going by what you said) Ven's transformed into Oathkeeper and Sora's tranformed Oblivion. The relevence of time is that it takes time for the dormant memory to awaken. Ven's originally turned into Wayward, but had to restart when Roxas summoned it then reawakened it into Oathkeeper. Basically what I'm trying to say is that my theory is Vanitas, MX, M.E. , Mickey, Aqua, and Terra's Keychains had already awakened by the time of BBS. If Vanitas had summoned his Keyblade right after being plucked out of Ven's heart and it was Void Gear than that would proof against it. But there are no first time summons that can disprove it. Seeing as each first time summon was using the same Keyblade. Also note that Mickey's Keychain: Star Seeker is given to Sora, yet it's supposed to be only Mic's Keychain. Now if you want to assume that Mickey switched-out the Keychains so Sora could use it in KH2 and then switched-out the two (Keychain) for Coded, be my guest.

Let me get this straight, you used something that you don't know as a way to win the discussion? For the record, I'm saying all STARTER KEYCHAINS look one of two ways on the surface. When they awaken they turn into something different. Keychains made from other memories will often be unique, but Oathkeeper, Oblivion, and Ultima Weapon are some of the few or many exceptions.



X-Blade or Death-Blade is not a Keyblade, nor is it a type of one (Not that it's relevent to the discussion).



In the report above ^ Xehanort reffers to the Keyblade being possibly a man-made counterparts of KH (Which kinda begs the question how if this is true). They represent memories, as if Keyblades really are supposed to mirror Kingdom Hearts then Memory may or may not be essential. But if we take Marluxia's words about Sora's heart being destroyed, it basically implies the Memory which these Keychains represent stabalize a Keyblade. Thus a Keyblade such as HO/KoPH is unstable, perhaps this could explain why it's able to unlock people's hearts in dangerous manner. However, the Death-Blade coexists with KH and has a Keychain of it's own, though perhaps that's one thing that seperates a Keyblade from the Death-Blade (It works without any draw-backs).

Seeing as Nobodies are so into artifical things (Replicas to name one) it wouldn't be hard to believe that Gears are artifical Keychains. However, that's more of shot in the dark, if not one with a few lit lamps to guide the way.

HO does/did not possess a Keychain

Not so sure a memory alone can choose, but who knows.

That's actually a satisfactory arguement for me. Wait until I find something to disagree on.

 

[Dawn Rebirth]

To be specific: Roxas uses Sora's body and soul as his physical presence. His own memories and mind/spirit/sense of self (or whatever you want to call it) are what Roxas himself is.
Ven's heart gave him more than just looks actually, as there was the ability to feel for real. Nobodies do exist, they can interact and develop on their own, the "don't exist" part only comes from the broader defintion of in-universe laws which they don't abide by.
See, and on that we're actually on the same boat, Roxas wouldn't want to be compared to Ven, but he also doesn't want to be compared to Sora.
Mix different things together and you get something new, which is exactly what Roxas was during his short physical existence.


Where did you get that bolded part from? That is neither hinted nor anywhere plausible anywhere in the series.
Keychains aren't "dormant" memories, keychains are additions crafted for a keyblade either by people (in KH1) or by worlds (KH2, with the exception of Fenrir). The first (or "base") keychain (which is at the same time the default look of said keyblade) is crafted the first time the wielder awakens his/her keyblade, making that one the "base" keychain for the blade.
With Terra, this is the Earthshaker, with Aqua, it is the Rainfell, Ven the Wayward Wind, Riku the Way to Dawn and Sora the KK, there is no reason to suddenly think that every keyblade looks the same at the beginning.
Keychains don't get awakened, they get created by memories and connections between people/worlds. When TAV, Vanitas or anyone received their blades they created their personal base "keychain" for it, adding a step between just overcomplicates things.




No, I said I don't know why there is such a fuss made about it ("bases" talk) as it was already clear that every keyblade is unique. You make it sound as if the KK and KKD-keychains are something special which they aren't, the KK is just the default keychain of Sora's blade and the KKD is the keychain of one blade from the RoD.
There exists absolutely no evidence/suggestion to this being different as "Starter keychains" as you called them take their unique form directly according to the heart of their wielders.
The KK IS Sora's starter keychain, that's why he uses it most of times.



The X-Blade is not a "normal" keyblade, but that's also why I put it outside the three "normal" categories. It stands uniquely on its own as the ultimate weapon, but is still a keyblade since its the key to Kingdom Hearts directly.

Okay, that I'll agree with.

Kinda thought that was implied, so that's why I didn't mention it. Hearts make all things feel emotions. That I'll also agree on.

Yet compared to, they are, by actual characters in the games :/

True.

You have to take certain bits and put them together. 1. Roxas arrives with two KKs, clashes them together, they shatter in appearance (As if sheding their form), and become Oathkeeper and Oblivion. 2. YS and AN both state hearts can go to sleep. 3. Memory is part of the heart. 4. When a person forgets, in a sense those memories go to sleep. 5. I believe Starter Keychains are dormant memories (For how does one such as Aladdin make a magical Keychain. And what could a world use other than that 'memory from that moment' to craft a Keychain?).

And yet first summons have not be anything but KKs or KK-D? The bases for the Keychains are different, but in a sense their still developing.

Didn't say all Keyblades look the same. HO/KoPH, KK, and KKD all look different.

I understand that, they personalize it over a period of time. They personalize the Starter Keychain. The Personalization of the Keychain personalizes the Keyblade's form. The Starter Keychain is a memory of existence, a memory of that person existing, and what became of them effects the process of personalizing that Keychain. Keychains made from Memories and Connections afterwards are the ones they recieve during the journey. Also, creating takes time, it takes time for person to first summon their Keyblade. It takes time to make connections, etc. You make it sound like Personalization happens like that, when it most likely doesn't.

So Keyblades can be unique, but one of the things that allows it to be personalized cannot unique? That makes sense how?

Once again, take certain bits and you'll find both.

Odd how Sora wasn't always using KK, while Roxas was. Once again, PERSONALIZATION takes time, if Sora isn't using the starter, then he can't really personalize it (Especially, when he's too busy not thinking about Personalizing his Starter Keychain).

I'm not going repeat the quote, but the difference between the Death-Blade and a Keyblade, is a Keyblade is man-made, while the Death-Blade coexists with KH. The only reason MX reffers to it as a "Keyblade" is because 'Kee' is how your pronounce the ancient letter that is used in it's title: χ-blade.