The meaning of Unbirth

[final sentient]

ok.. ok... if you say so

 

[The Enchanted]

So your basically saying that unbirth = No birth?

And if their is no birth then their is no life. That makes sense.

Kinda.
Unbirth=Not birth=No origin or point of begining.

heres what I'm thinkin, unbirth = body/heart , no soul... what do ya think.

No.
Unbirths most likely (if at all), will be having to do with the whole being, not an aspect of it, like the Heartless and Nobodies.

You may just be on to something. Probably the best Unbirth theory I've read so far.

Xehanort was unable to remember a beginning, perhaps this is connected to him being an Unbirth?

Thank you!
And no, Xehanort most likely had memory loss and Unbirths didn't exist after BbS.

 

[Radon]

has anyone ever realised that nobody actually are nothing but bodies and heartless are nothing but hearts. so would that mean that unbirths have infact been born?

 

[Smile]

Well, he'd be a "human shaped Unbirth". I'd call that an exception we can play with.

 

[keybladelegacy]

Kinda.
Unbirth=Not birth=No origin or point of begining.

So how would this make unbirth not exist after bbs.

No.
Unbirths most likely (if at all), will be having to do with the whole being, not an aspect of it, like the Heartless and Nobodies.

I would think its the soul.

ok.. ok... if you say so

When the soul leaves the body, its vessel, life gives way to death,

has anyone ever realised that nobody actually are nothing but bodies and heartless are nothing but hearts. so would that mean that unbirths have infact been born?

Heart = Heartless
Nobody = Body and Soul
Unbirth = ???(Soul)

 

[Smile]

A Soul would indicate Birth, if its absence means death, imo. Thus Unbirths aren't the Soul, going by this notion that Unbirths were never born. It's either they're more, or they're something else.

 

[zillagod]

Well if we think about this question in a less philosophical way, and stick to the KH universe then if you remember from KH 1, Xehanort says that (in his opinon at least) all hearts are born from darkness. If we took this statement and thought about the unbirth or unborn question with this in mind being unborn could mean that you weren't born or didn't originate from darkness. I might be thinking to hard about it though.

 

[Smile]

Actually... that's a nice idea o.o and a good observation.
Though that does make me think about the PoHs.

 

[zillagod]

Also I just saw this alternate trailer wich mentions that MX is looking for hearts of pure light. YouTube - Kingdom Hearts: Birth By Sleep - Trailer (Remastered)

 

[Andillexe]

Heart = Heartless
Nobody = Body and Soul
Unbirth = ???(Soul)

What if the Unbirths were made of memories and the mind? Because Ansem the Wise found Xehanort without any memories of who he was or where he came from. All he could remember was the name "Xehanort." And when Sora turned into a heartless, he said that as he was falling through darkness he started to forget about his friends and who he was. Could it be since Unbirths didn't have memories, and heartless are the decendents (?) of Unbirths, heartless don't have any memories of who they were. I'm not sure whether or not Nobodies have memories of who they were. Roxas didn't have memories of Sora until Namine started messing around in Sora's heart, but I don't know about the other Nobodies.

 

[zillagod]

I can't say for sure but I have a strong feeling that unborn are physical representations of chaos or neutrality. They did not originate in darkness or in light, they just exist; perhaps they are just wild and chaotic beings that came from nothingness and thus have no memories or previous experiences?

 

[Smile]

That wouldn't really relate them too much to the Heartless and Nobodies :\

 

[Final_Oblivion]

So, unbirths are the true nobodies. Having no physical presence, heart and/or any orgin confirming their existance?

 

[zillagod]

Well they are the predecessors to heartless and nobodies, so they had to find some kind of objective before they could become heartless or nobodies, chaos and neutrality just means they didn't have any goals then. That doesn't mean they couldn't develop thier own goals over time.

So, unbirths are the true nobodies. Having no physical presence, heart and/or any orgin confirming their existance?

In a way yes they are.

 

[Iridium]

So, unbirths are the true nobodies. Having no physical presence, heart and/or any orgin confirming their existance?

But for something to exist physically, matter must be present; even that law applies to KH to a degree. So if they are nothing, no "physical presence" that would mean they wouldn't even be the predecessors to the heartless. They wouldn't exist altogether.

 

[3-D]

what if unbirths are whole beings that were banished to the realm of nothingness and seized to exist?

the memories/sense of self/soul combined with nothingness=unbirth
imo
i mean think about it...it gives meaning behind unbirth...and the unbirths dont exist anymore because no one siezed to exist in the realm of nothingness anymore

...well it makes sense to me!

 

[Smile]

The only thing we have to go on in that sense is AtW's reports, and even then it's much more likely he was describing him losing his mind and eventually about to become a Heartless, rather than anything beyond it.

 

[3-D]

<TABLE class=Content width="99%" align=center itxtvisited="1"><TBODY itxtvisited="1"><TR itxtvisited="1"><TD class=light_gray width="100%" colSpan=4 itxtvisited="1">Secret Ansem Report 4</TD></TR><TR itxtvisited="1"><TD width=5 itxtvisited="1"></TD><TD width="100%" itxtvisited="1">The distant days spent in that beautiful paradise are an illusion to me now.
How long have I been here, banished to the realm of nothingness?
It is only by relying upon my anger and hatred that I have been able to retain my sense of self here, where all existence is nullified.
My heart is being overcome with hatred toward my apprentices, possessed by the darkness, and with the anger I feel for stupidly allowing myself to be betrayed.
Is this darkness, eating away at my heart?
I cannot continue to idle away my time here.
What are Xehanort and the others attempting to do?
I must unravel the mystery of these Ansem Reports, intercept my apprentices, and defeat them.
That is my <SPAN5197047 itxtvisited="1">mission</SPAN5197047>…the only way to repay the world for my sins.
Those beings who lack hearts—the Heartless—must be the key.
The darkness of the heart, made flesh. Cursed shadows who not only lack hearts, but multiply by seizing hearts from any and all living things.
Where have they come from, and where are they going?
Three elements combine to create life: a heart, a soul, and a body.
But what of the soul and body left behind when the heart is lost?
When the soul <SPAN5197047 itxtvisited="1">leaves</SPAN5197047> the body, its vessel, life gives way to death, but what about when the heart leaves?
A being does not perish when its heart leaves its body. The heart alone disappears into the darkness.
There is little time.
If I remain in this realm much longer, I will certainly learn these answers the hard way.
My heart is already a captive of the darkness.
________
there is nothing directly saying that he was turning into a heartless. Just that darkness was eating away at his heart. If the darkness did overcome him, surely the nothingness would be soon to follow, then his sense of self (in my short theory thing) plus the nothingness would create his unbirth.imo
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

 

[keybladelegacy]

there is nothing directly saying that he was turning into a heartless. Just that darkness was eating away at his heart. If the darkness did overcome him, surely the nothingness would be soon to follow, then his sense of self (in my short theory thing) plus the nothingness would create his unbirth.imo

Well if he stayed in that realm im sure he wouldve turned into a heartless.

What if the Unbirths were made of memories and the mind?

Hmmm........

Because Ansem the Wise found Xehanort without any memories of who he was or where he came from. All he could remember was the name "Xehanort."

Ya because of the events in bbs.

And when Sora turned into a heartless, he said that as he was falling through darkness he started to forget about his friends and who he was.

Heartless dont have any memories of their previous self.

Could it be since Unbirths didn't have memories, and heartless are the decendents (?) of Unbirths, heartless don't have any memories of who they were.

If this were true i would say the process of the unbirths would be similar to the heartless.

I'm not sure whether or not Nobodies have memories of who they were.

It depends, all of the organazation has memories before they became nobodies except roxas and xion.
And namine if she counts.

Roxas didn't have memories of Sora until Namine started messing around in Sora's heart, but I don't know about the other Nobodies.

He still didnt have any memories of sora. Its because mainly one is sora was solely a heart and his memories stayed intact instead of going to roxas.

 

[3-D]

can heartless even exist in the realm of nothingness without turning into something else? *cough* unbirth *cough*