Donald and Goofy continue to be massively underrated and disregarded by fans. So many people want them to be replaced by Riku and Kairi.
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The fact that I got two very different counterarguments to the complaint of Aqua not having her own nemesis sort of supports my point. On a conceptual level Aqua has less effort put into her. Terra is the young man that became Xehanort's vessel. Ventus is the boy who had his heart ripped into two and his other half is the source of the Unversed. What is Aqua? The good student and responsible one? I've seen some people argue that that's the point, Xehanort not properly accounting is why his plans ended up failing, but that doesn't excuse the neglect from a meta perspective.
but that doesn't excuse the neglect from a meta perspective.
What is Aqua? The good student and responsible one?
Most of those points seem less like an intentional arc and more her characterization being thin enough to project an arc retroactively. Pretend we're back in 2010 and BbS has just been released. How many fans would think that Aqua was her own worst enemy? 0.2 is a great character piece, but it's also the type of story one would write if you are putting a spotlight on a character but don't want to introduce anything truly new. Combing through her existing story and putting together the pieces you find in ways that weren't necessarily intended when originally written, but still fit.But most of my points were related to her character in BbS. She didn't call herself master until Terranort. She constantly referred to herself as someone still in training and not a hero even though she literally passed the test and is a master. In her final moments in BbS, she's pretty much ready to end it all and fade into darkness. 0.2 just expanded on those points. All of Anti-Aqua's quotes in 0.2 are basically from BbS.
The point that Aqua lacks a true nemesis. Is it herself or Vanitas? Because her male counterparts have very clear answers to the question of who their ultimate villains are.What point? Her popularity? Because I never really argued against that (as it's blatantly obvious, specially in KHI. I don't think everyone needs to like her character, that will always boil down to personal opinion.), but you didn't really say anything about her rivalry with Vanitas working just fine as a villain for her rote.
is it really "witnessing" if she wasn't there and just heard about it from a third party?ended up witnessing the death of her Master (in the hands of her best friend to save her other best friend)
And on top of this said third party (Yen Sid) has also no idea what exactly happened either since he only "knows" via his stargazing or whatever he does that "Eraqus' star blinked out" and that both Xehanort and Terra were somehow involved.is it really "witnessing" if she wasn't there and just heard about it from a third party?
Most of those points seem less like an intentional arc and more her characterization being thin enough to project an arc retroactively. Pretend we're back in 2010 and BbS has just been released. How many fans would think that Aqua was her own worst enemy? 0.2 is a great character piece, but it's also the type of story one would write if you are putting a spotlight on a character but don't want to introduce anything truly new. Combing through her existing story and putting together the pieces you find in ways that weren't necessarily intended when originally written, but still fit.
But okay, I'll bite. Let's assume for the sake of argument that Aqua was intended to be her own worst enemy from the beginning. If so, that arc is very neglected and underwritten. Call it "subtle" if you want, but most fans did not get that out of her story at the time of release, which means the writers failed. The fact that BbS volume 2 was never greenlit means that there was no guarantee that the strongest parts or her arc would ever see the light of day. In the end a place was found for it, but it's very easy to imagine a scenario where it didn't work out (for example, deciding to feature Xehanort's past instead.)
And I thought this went without saying, but apparently not: I am ultimately judging and BbS by the versions we have, not the perfect versions that exist in the platonic realm. I know that the writing of KH is weak enough that fans have to read in between the lines to find substance for most characters, but you also have to accept that other people won't necessarily see what you see.
The point that Aqua lacks a true nemesis. Is it herself or Vanitas? Because her male counterparts have very clear answers to the question of who their ultimate villains are.
Just think of it this way: you could take Terra and Xehanort out of BbS and isolate them into an independent narrative and you'd still have a story. Put Ventus and Vanitas into their own game and you still have a story. But isolate Aqua and suddenly you have no story, because Aqua's arc exists to compliment the stories of Terra and Ven, not because there's a high concept at the center of her character. (I suppose we could follow your suggestion and put Vanitas as her enemy, he even considered using her as a substitute in canon. But at this point it's less her story and more replacing Ven.)
You could argue that it doesn't matter because the BbS we have is the intertwined story of all three characters and maybe you'd be right. And despite everything I've said in this I actually do like Aqua. I just feel that she's an okay character instead of one of the best in the franchise.
The point that Aqua lacks a true nemesis. Is it herself or Vanitas? Because her male counterparts have very clear answers to the question of who their ultimate villains are.
Just think of it this way: you could take Terra and Xehanort out of BbS and isolate them into an independent narrative and you'd still have a story. Put Ventus and Vanitas into their own game and you still have a story. But isolate Aqua and suddenly you have no story, because Aqua's arc exists to compliment the stories of Terra and Ven, not because there's a high concept at the center of her character.
Fair point. I suppose it doesn't really count.is it really "witnessing" if she wasn't there and just heard about it from a third party?
That's me. It's sort of like how I always think of Kairi in relation to some of her early quotes about Riku in KH1. That Aqua's story was one of self-doubt makes it worse that her friends decided to lash out at her out of jealousy rather than encourage their friend. Anyway, I don't see most of this talk about Aqua's story / arc as unfounded since BbS vol. 2 was always intended. When that game was cancelled, its story was mutated into 0.2 since they couldn't make a full game out of it. If the ReMIXes had not allowed them to tack on a mini-game like 0.2, I have no doubt we would've got an even more truncated version of it as KH3's prologue. Well, really, 0.2 already is KH3's prologue, imo, considering 3 is completely lacking one.kirabook said:Her friends never once congratulated her (some Aqua fans hold this against Terra and Ven even to this day, I don't).
I never said this. If you would stop trying to cram your words into my mouth that would be cool, thanks.0.2 did not pull this stuff out of thin air like you seem to be implying.