Would KH3 be better if they included DDD's story in it? (multiple choice)

[Enturax]

I mean, as long as we would leave all that filler "Need to travel across random worlds to relearn Power of Waking" bullcrap and provide few tweaks in the plot to make the games connect with each other smoothly.

 

[Perkilator]

If anything, I’d rather they used Dream Eaters for Toy Box.

 

[OneDandelion]

Even if they did combine them both, if they left out the unimportant filler material you probably would only have enough there for a 10 hour game, most of which would be cutscenes segregated by boss fights.

I don't think that would make KH3 a better game, it would just make it less of a time sink.

 

[AR829038]

Yes, I think it absolutely would have helped.
Even though I will defend the importance of the Disney worlds in KH3 to my death (no matter how you slice it, they were all more relevant to the main plot than the worlds of KH2—fight me), I have no problem ceding that the excuse of Sora needing to go there for the power of waking was a total bust, and I can see many ways in which fusing the two games into one would have helped.
For one thing, you could have the game split into several parts wherein Sora goes through the Sleeping Worlds to obtain the power, while Riku is tasked with traversing the KH3 worlds in order to locate Terra. During both of their journeys, you could have the new Organization gradually reveal themselves across both the Sleeping Worlds and the real one—they even have the Organization perfectly apportioned into Nobodies and replicas for them to be split evenly amongst these two storylines. You could have Terra-Xehanort, Young Xehanort, Vanitas, Riku Replica, and Ansem pestering Sora in the Sleeping Realm (since in the Sleeping Realm they don't need Replica bodies to move about) and then you could simultaneously have Xemnas, Larxene, Marluxia, Xigbar, Saïx, and Luxord pestering Riku in the Realm of Light. Then, you could have Vexen create replica bodies for the norts in the Sleeping Realm over the course of the game so that they are able to exist in the Realm of Light in time for the final confrontation. This way, not only is there more of a purpose in going to the KH3 worlds, but there's also more mystery as to the buildup of the antagonists. Back when KH2 came out, we didn't know who the Organization really were or what their goals were—so much about the story was kept shrouded in mystery, and that's part of what made KH2 so enjoyable as a story. Giving away the identity of the villains as well as their goal in DDD spoiled that mystery for KH3—we knew too much going into it, which made the gradual approach to the climax feel more like a slog.
This also would have given the game a better excuse as to why they'd need to rescue Aqua and Ventus near the end of the game, because in this rendition, Sora wouldn't obtain the power of waking until near the end anyway.
The one singular downside to this fusion, depending on how you look at it, is that it would make the game REALLY long. Like, massive. But honestly, I wouldn't have a problem with that. It'd probably only be an issue if you were concerned about data space on your PS4.
I give the developers a bit of slack for not doing it this way because, back when DDD came out, they probably didn't figure they would actually end up making KH3 on an engine that could support a really massive world and story, so they didn't think ahead about the possibility of fusing the storylines. The other fact is, keep in mind, the period of time between Kingdom Hearts coded (the last game before DDD) and KH3 was about 11 years, and during that period DDD was the only real fully fledged game to be released (not counting 0.2 because it's kind of a glorified demo, and not counting Union X because blegh!). I imagine that, even if they did figure they could do this huge story on the PS4, that making fans wait 11 years for an actual KH game would be too much. And let's all be honest—it would have.

 

[disney233]

DDD reeled in time travel (A VERY messy tropue) into the mix of this already messy story......so no.

 

[Ballad of Caius]

With the corner that Nomura had written himself into? Hell no. It would have made the game worse.

 

[Henryp]

Partially. What I believe would work better is to shuffle some concepts from DDD into KH3 and some concepts form KH3 into DDD.

DDD has a severe lack of cohesion as its own. Dreams are utterly unexplained and we never get an in-game reasoning for why there are sleeping worlds in the first place. Then time travel is threw at you at the climax and feels out-of-place in regards with the overal plot of the game. With KH3 we get some connection between time travel and the power of waking, and more insights into what dreams are and how they connect to the death.

On the other side, KH3 suffers to be its own instalment regarding its storyline because the main conflict is presented in DDD and not in KH3 itself, leaving the game without a breakthrough moment until it reachs the climax (what I do believe many people takes as in the mayority of the game the storyline doesn't happen). And while KH3 gives more insights into the power of waking and how it ties with time travel and bla bla bla, KH3 does not expend the required time after the mess DDD created.

What I think would benefit both games is to incorporate the concepts of dreams/death/power of waking/time travel better trough DDD, tying up what could be potentially a good approach into the metaphysics of KH universe, and finish the game the moment Sora gets into the slumber and Riku finish the test. Make Riku battle Young Xehanort as the endgame boss before he reaches the end of TWTNW and make him return to Mysterious Tower.

Then start KH3 on a bang with Riku diving into Sora to reach him at Where Nothing Gathers (I think thats the name) as the prologue. Let the events play out the same as DDD, making Xehanort return and the revelation of the XIII vs VII kayblade war be the event that pushes KH3. KH3 would play out the same, although I would make a little more emphasis in the power of waking in the Disney worlds than the subtle thematic we got, and make Riku and Aqua segments in RG and Realm of Darkness playable to to generate space between the Disney worlds. To much fanboying, but that would have solve the problems I see in both games.

At the end of the day, if I remember correctly, DDD was taken out of the draft Nomura had for the KH3 storyline when asked to do a game for the 3DS. And originally he planned the ending of that game differently. I do believe Nomura had immature concepts in mind when doing DDD, and that gave KH3 a hard time trying to make sense out of it. Most of the problems I see in KH3 stem directly from the things DDD failed to explore or took away of KH3.

 

[okhi12]

You don't fix a mess by adding a bigger mess.
That said, I love both games. But the execution of the story was rather bad in KH3 and DDD was even worse.

 

[NoWay]

At first I thought definitely not. But what if l the first 4 KH3 worlds consisted of the DDD arc? With TWTNW as the 5th world being the midpoint of the game. The next 4 worlds could build up the KG events with KG being the 10th and last world.

Sounds epic tbh

 

[Elysium]

^ That's what I was thinking. Cut a few of the worlds. Put Toy Box in the dream realm and Notre Dame in the real world. Dream Eaters for your party members in the first half (Lea saving Sora at TWTNW being the midpoint of the game) and D&G for the second half.

World list:
Dream half:
Traverse Town
Prankster’s Paradise
Toy Box
Symphony of Sorcerery
The World That Never Was

Real world half:
Olympus Coliseum
Notre Dame
Monstropolis
Arendelle
The Caribbean
Keyblade Graveyard

I think it could’ve been fun, personally.

 

[Face My Fears]

No way! The only concept I've ever somewhat disliked in the KH series were the dream eaters/nightmares (maybe because they replaced Donald and Goofy/Disney party members). I really didn't like that enemies you find on the streets are your allies, I rather the allies be something special/unique. Also, I would have been severely disappointed to not have a full-fledged journey with Donald and Goofy. If I had to spend more than 2-3 hours with dream eaters and be in a "dream realm" in KH3, it would have been such a downer. 3D was perfect as a handheld title. The only game I can really see and would have liked included in the KH3 story was 0.2. I think they should have included 0.2 and a segment where you play as Kairi/Lea before you get to Sora. That way it could have reflected the Face My Fears intro more - you see a bit of TAV, some of Kairi and some of RAX (through Kairi/Lea flashbacks or conversations).

 

[Absent]

See the thing is, the problem wasn't DDD, 3 or any game. Its the lack of restraint and vision for past plot points and characters. The games are not the problems, they're the result of writing gone unchecked.

 

[2 quid is good]

See the thing is, the problem wasn't DDD, 3 or any game. Its the lack of restraint and vision for past plot points and characters. The games are not the problems, they're the result of writing gone unchecked.

Wish I could like a post more than once

 

[SweetYetSalty]

I don't know. I mean some elements could work, but I don't know. The Dream Eaters are total side game territory and devoting a large chunk of the game to them would feel like a slog for a main entry title. The game would also be really long, dealing with DDD and KH3's story and then having to gather the 7 lights and 13 darkness' Some elements could work but overall it sounds like a giant cluster. Some things would have to be cut for it to work.

 

[Ballad of Caius]

See the thing is, the problem wasn't DDD, 3 or any game. Its the lack of restraint and vision for past plot points and characters. The games are not the problems, they're the result of writing gone unchecked.

Pretty much this. Reason as to why say that KH3 is Nomura writing himself into a corner.

 

[Enturax]

[...]Back when KH2 came out, we didn't know who the Organization really were or what their goals were—so much about the story was kept shrouded in mystery, and that's part of what made KH2 so enjoyable as a story. Giving away the identity of the villains as well as their goal in DDD spoiled that mystery for KH3—we knew too much going into it, which made the gradual approach to the climax feel more like a slog.
[...]

Yeah, this is why I think they should have had connected the plot points or just turn DDD into KH3 because it felt like KH3 had nothing to offer when it came to the characters. Heck, they teased us with Xehanort's backstory but all we saw was him and Eraqus playing chess... and we've already seen it in the trailers anyway...

 

[cakito123]

Then start KH3 on a bang with Riku diving into Sora to reach him at Where Nothing Gathers (I think thats the name) as the prologue. Let the events play out the same as DDD, making Xehanort return and the revelation of the XIII vs VII kayblade war be the event that pushes KH3. KH3 would play out the same, although I would make a little more emphasis in the power of waking in the Disney worlds than the subtle thematic we got, and make Riku and Aqua segments in RG and Realm of Darkness playable to to generate space between the Disney worlds. To much fanboying, but that would have solve the problems I see in both games.

That's the only way I could see it work. Reallistally tho, if this game were to be a clash between DDD and KH3, ther would be a complete set of new worlds, so that wouldn't be a problem. I only see benefits on the main story to this idea.
Riku would work as a Roxas in KH2, providing the tutorial section and starting the game (i really think some kind of prologue was what I missed the most in KH3), only to save sora and give the player control over our boy again. Much like Roxas did in the end of his prologue too. That would not only make it better for the game overall, but it would make us angrier at Xehanort's clones in the start of the adventure.

 

[disney233]

Back when KH2 came out, we didn't know who the Organization really were or what their goals were—so much about the story was kept shrouded in mystery, and that's part of what made KH2 so enjoyable as a story. Giving away the identity of the villains as well as their goal in DDD spoiled that mystery for KH3—we knew too much going into it, which made the gradual approach to the climax feel more like a slog.

Even if they were revealed one by one, it would still be a slog BECAUSE THE 'NEW' ORGANIZATION IS LITERALLY THE SAME EXACT PEOPLE -4!

 

[Veevee]

See the thing is, the problem wasn't DDD, 3 or any game. Its the lack of restraint and vision for past plot points and characters. The games are not the problems, they're the result of writing gone unchecked.

This and the fact that Nomura tries so hard to connect every little thing he never even dreamed to bring in the same context one day which partially leads to pure bullshit, e.g. that Mickey knew where Aqua was, has been there again in Re:Com AND had a keyblade that allowed him to walk into the RoD anytime with upgraded gear makes him look like a total ass and no one ever bats an eye about that. Things like this were never meant to be connected and never should've been.

 

[disney233]

This and the fact that Nomura tries so hard to connect every little thing he never even dreamed to bring in the same context one day which partially leads to pure bullshit, e.g. that Mickey knew where Aqua was, has been there again in Re:Com AND had a keyblade that allowed him to walk into the RoD anytime with upgraded gear makes him look like a total ass and no one ever bats an eye about that. Things like this were never meant to be connected and never should've been.

Mickey not even THINKING of retrieving Aqua when he had AMPLE time to do so throughout the ENTIRETY of the series is proof of Nomura not thinking things through. WHO WAITS 10 YEARS TO LOOK FOR SOMEONE AND THEN ANOTHER YEAR TO FIND THAT PERSON AND (Keep it secret by the Master's order)