Reason why Atlantica isn't in BBS
- Thread starter Unusual1290
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So what if it was in KH1 and 2? Olympus Coliseum was in KH1, 2, CoM, Days, coded, AND BBS. A w/e with the Aqua thing. That's not a big deal, if Disney was worried about censoring her, then they could just make her wear a corset instead of a bikini. I also think the reason it isn't in BBS is because people complain about it too much. People are never satisfied! People thought it was stupid in KH1 cuz of the controls and when it was in KH2 people thought it was stupid cuz of the musical game. If it was in BBS, if it was a regular world, and if they were merpeople, the controls couldnt be much different from KH1s cuz there isn't a second control stick to make it easier. That's prolly why they don't get to fly in Never Land cuz flying and swimming have the same controls in KH1, and people didn't like them.
Well I for one loved Atlantica in KH1, the controls are what made it challenging and unique. However, in KH2 it was terrible. The only reason I played it was to get the SE and Ultima weapon. I would love for Nomura to redeam himself and put Atlantica in BBS and make it like it was in KH1, but it doesn't look like that will happen 
I imagine the main reason it isn't in BbS is because there's not a lot of story to work with at the time of Ariel's toddler-hood. Not to mention, the younger incarnation of any of the characters were only featured in pre/sequels, and since KH hasn't shown any favor of those at all in the past, I can only assume they're deliberately avoiding it.
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I think the main reason it isn't in Birth By Sleep is because Ariel would only be 6. They should of put it in there to see why Triton hates the keyblade so much but otherwise the main protagonist is too young.
You people who have this obsession over Atlantica seriously need to get over it.
Before we knew BbS existed (hell, before KH2 was announced), how did you think Triton knew about the keyblade? Gee, maybe he just, you know, picked up on it like any legend or found out by some other non-relevant means. Why can't you leave it like that?
The point is that it shouldn't matter how he found out. Had they included Atlantica for some odd reason, great, but Triton's knowledge of the keyblade is certaintly not the grounds they would use for including it. Completely unnecessary. Just because BbS is a prequel does not mean that every minute detail of previous games has to be explained.
Really though, as has been said, there's just not enough story they should flesh out for Atlantica, and that ought to be the reason why it didn't make the cut. Sure, Little Mermaid 3 provides backstory so that they could include it (and aknowledge the time shift with a younger Ariel and Triton), but that doesn't mean it should. Because LM3 blew.
Before we knew BbS existed (hell, before KH2 was announced), how did you think Triton knew about the keyblade? Gee, maybe he just, you know, picked up on it like any legend or found out by some other non-relevant means. Why can't you leave it like that?
The point is that it shouldn't matter how he found out. Had they included Atlantica for some odd reason, great, but Triton's knowledge of the keyblade is certaintly not the grounds they would use for including it. Completely unnecessary. Just because BbS is a prequel does not mean that every minute detail of previous games has to be explained.
Really though, as has been said, there's just not enough story they should flesh out for Atlantica, and that ought to be the reason why it didn't make the cut. Sure, Little Mermaid 3 provides backstory so that they could include it (and aknowledge the time shift with a younger Ariel and Triton), but that doesn't mean it should. Because LM3 blew.
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I agree with this. The Nomura team does listen to fan feedback and work to improve the games based on such feedback, but KH2 proves that they tend to go overboard. They changed Atlantica in KH2, it was flamed, so might as well scrap it . Makes me wonder though why didn't they just make it a normal world. It will lose its charm, but at least it will be better than the musicals in most people's eyes.
This to the ends of the world.
Imo, BBS serves to provide backstory for unexplained plot points in KH1 and KH2, so I'm pretty sure Triton's knowledge would be the main reason for Atlantica to be included if it really was included in BBS. It just so happens the complications of putting in Atlantica overweighs the pros.
And yet the entire plot of Deep Space involves around only 15 minutes of the original story. A little creative effort can go a long way into developing a backstory for that world, particularly since we have a few unexplained plot points, but again, Atlantica is just too complicated a world technical-wise and fan opinion-wise to put in. (Although I have little faith in 'creavity' and 'effort' when it comes to the Disney world stories ever since KH2 and Days, although from what we have seen, BBS did restore it somewhat)
To be honest I don't see why they put Deep Space in there, IMO it sucks, it's just another Pride Lands, at least if they don't let us play Atlantica or Aladin or Halloween town ect they could show us the cut scenes of how Maleficents group got together.
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At least it explains how Stitch ended up in Hollow Bastion, and gave us the theme of 'friendship' and 'bonds' which links to TAV. Pride Lands is worse imo cos it copied the movie plot exactly without even being connected to the main plot.
Now get back on topic. XD
I said that there's not enough story that they should, not could, flesh out.
You're right in that a little creative licensing can be good.
But Lilo and Stitch hasn't been portrayed at all in KH (Stitch's little cameo had no similarities to any scene in his movie), whereas the Little Mermaid has been depicted twice. In both cases, it's been based on the same movie, and, frankly, neither LM2 or LM3 is worth depicting at all. So it's pretty clear that the well has run dry for the Little Mermaid.
Even if it's just based on 15 minutes of the movie, that's 15 minutes more than the Little Mermaid has to offer.
You might be asking yourself why they can't just use an entirely original scenario for the Little Mermaid in BbS. And there's two reasons why they shouldn't do that.
- They're pretty bad at making scenarios which aren't based on movies. See: Plenty of the second world visits in KH2.
- More importantly, it's ignoring the point of the Disney worlds altogether. There ought to be a balance between original interaction ("meddling" as Donald puts it) and plot derived directly from the movies. Too much emphasis on plot from the movies makes the worlds boring (What's the point in playing the game when you can watch the movies?) and distances them from the central plot. Too much originality diminishes that sense of nostalgia and, as I've said, more often than not turns out pretty shoddy.
So without any good material left for the Little Mermaid, it has no place in BbS or in the future of the series. It has served its purpose.
I still find the idea of including it primarily on Triton's comment to be ludicrous.
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can you imagine playing atlantica with no camera control i sure can't
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@Grace Assassin:
That's my point. Deep Space is not using the main plot of Lilo and Stitch, but the first 15 minutes, providing them with limited choices to put into that world, yet they are using everything shown in those 15 minutes to their advantage (i.e. the laser gun battle) while creatively taking up plot elements from elsewhere and merging them together (Sparky). And this scenario can't exactly be called nostalgic, since we were in the spaceship only briefly in the movie, yet it is not entirely original to the extent that it loses its charm.
The same can be said for Atlantica. While it is true most of the well has gone dry, the writers can always creatively come up with plot elements like they did with Deep Space, say putting in Ariel's mom's death, Ursula's banishment, then tie them up with TAV's involvement and Triton's fear of Keyblades to create a story. It actually has good material if the writers take the initiative to do so.
As for whether it serves it purpose, I agree with you that it has already done so now that the Ariel's storyline is wrapped up, and that her past is not vital to the series. I'm just pointing out that Atlantica actually has legitimate reasons to be included and has a place in BBS as compared to say 100 Acre Wood, since that world is better off being Sora-exclusive and has nothing new to offer(and yes I know that they say it is only for the Command Board, but I'm taking that info with a grain of salt. )
IMO, Days is a lot worse than KH2 when it comes to depicting non-movie based Disney scenarios. At least in KH2, the second visits of Land of Dragons, Beast's Castle, Port Royal and Halloween Town had fairly good concepts which had ties to the main plot and would have been interesting if explored further had the idea of visiting each world twice and copying the plot of the original movies been scrapped. The Disney stories in Days were just dull however. Hence me losing faith in their handling of the world stories ever since these two games.
That's my point. Deep Space is not using the main plot of Lilo and Stitch, but the first 15 minutes, providing them with limited choices to put into that world, yet they are using everything shown in those 15 minutes to their advantage (i.e. the laser gun battle) while creatively taking up plot elements from elsewhere and merging them together (Sparky). And this scenario can't exactly be called nostalgic, since we were in the spaceship only briefly in the movie, yet it is not entirely original to the extent that it loses its charm.
The same can be said for Atlantica. While it is true most of the well has gone dry, the writers can always creatively come up with plot elements like they did with Deep Space, say putting in Ariel's mom's death, Ursula's banishment, then tie them up with TAV's involvement and Triton's fear of Keyblades to create a story. It actually has good material if the writers take the initiative to do so.
As for whether it serves it purpose, I agree with you that it has already done so now that the Ariel's storyline is wrapped up, and that her past is not vital to the series. I'm just pointing out that Atlantica actually has legitimate reasons to be included and has a place in BBS as compared to say 100 Acre Wood, since that world is better off being Sora-exclusive and has nothing new to offer(and yes I know that they say it is only for the Command Board, but I'm taking that info with a grain of salt. )
IMO, Days is a lot worse than KH2 when it comes to depicting non-movie based Disney scenarios. At least in KH2, the second visits of Land of Dragons, Beast's Castle, Port Royal and Halloween Town had fairly good concepts which had ties to the main plot and would have been interesting if explored further had the idea of visiting each world twice and copying the plot of the original movies been scrapped. The Disney stories in Days were just dull however. Hence me losing faith in their handling of the world stories ever since these two games.
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It was optional because it wasn't mostly affected coz king triton was powerful to be controled
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Being sneaky =/= Dull plot. We could have gain more insight on the Org's inner workings through their experiments in the worlds, like say realizing that treasures brings out the greed in humanity and Roxas is assigned to help some Org member plant them around the world in order to tempt people into darkness. Just because we don't interact with Disney characters doesn't mean some interesting questions about the human heart, morality and emotions couldn't be brought up. If anything, the plots should have been more interesting than KH1 and KH2 since you are in the role of villians working against the Disney characters.
Probably have to use a different game engine for marine levels, just couldn't fit it in.
Sucks story wise, though.
Sucks story wise, though.
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