So the Disney villains REALLY dropped the bomb in this game (not the dream ones)...

[Swordsy]

Okay, let's get something straight here real quick:

Sora and Riku go into the sleeping realm or whatever, and are unable to protect the real worlds. And somehow Maleficent and Pete know about this. They also somehow knew that nobody strong was at Disney castle. However, they did not act on this very well.

What do they do? The two kidnap a completely unguarded Minnie, in an unguarded Disney castle (well not totally unguarded, but all that were there were just KH's version of red coats), and just wait there for Mickey, Donald, and Goofy to come back......What the heck?

Okay, please correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't Maleficent have some control over the Heartless? And Pete too, through her. So why didn't they bring a whole army of Heartless, or at least a few really big ones, and lay siege to the castle? And technically Maleficent has like a whole army of little goblin thingies, but I don't think they ever showed up in the games.

And for that matter, where were all of the other Disney villains? Surely Maleficent still had ties with them. Yeah Ursula showed her ugly face up but failed miserably.

I mean really, this is just so stupid. They just wanted this game to be all about dumb ol' Xehnahort (again), and only him (again) that they forgot a big chunk of the Disney aspect of this. I mean the Disney villains are not stupid, or weak, give them some credit.


And on a slightly different note, what's stopping all the Disney villains from trying to get the Princesses of Heart again? If they know Sora and Riku cannot get in their way, then they should know it would be pretty easy to capture the Princesses.

 

[Oracle Spockanort]

Okay, let's get something straight here real quick:

Sora and Riku go into the sleeping realm or whatever, and are unable to protect the real worlds. And somehow Maleficent and Pete know about this. They also somehow knew that nobody strong was at Disney castle. However, they did not act on this very well.

Maleficent seems to still be a pawn of Xehanort. I would not doubt she was being used to distract Mickey and Yen Sid and waste a bit of time.

What do they do? The two kidnap a completely unguarded Minnie, in an unguarded Disney castle (well not totally unguarded, but all that were there were just KH's version of red coats), and just wait there for Mickey, Donald, and Goofy to come back......What the heck?

Like I said, to distract Mickey and Yen Sid.

Okay, please correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't Maleficent have some control over the Heartless? And Pete too, through her. So why didn't they bring a whole army of Heartless, or at least a few really big ones, and lay siege to the castle? And technically Maleficent has like a whole army of little goblin thingies, but I don't think they ever showed up in the games.

She does, but she doesn't seem to want to bother doing those things.

And for that matter, where were all of the other Disney villains? Surely Maleficent still had ties with them. Yeah Ursula showed her ugly face up but failed miserably.

Ursula is sorta...not in the RoL anymore considering she took a harpoon to the chest, and it seems to be that she was called to DI by somebody for whatever reason.

I mean really, this is just so stupid. They just wanted this game to be all about dumb ol' Xehnahort (again), and only him (again) that they forgot a big chunk of the Disney aspect of this. I mean the Disney villains are not stupid, or weak, give them some credit.

They haven't forgotten. I think you've forgotten that most of the villains we know of have been defeated by Sora, Donald, and Goofy so at the moment the Realm of Light is pretty safe. There are other people out there (Like King Mickey, the RG gang, etc) to protect the worlds.

And on a slightly different note, what's stopping all the Disney villains from trying to get the Princesses of Heart again? If they know Sora and Riku cannot get in their way, then they should know it would be pretty easy to capture the Princesses.

Considering the villains the Princesses of Heart were being kidnapped by are already gone, they won't be coming to take them.

 

[Chaser]

Okay, let's get something straight here real quick:

Sora and Riku go into the sleeping realm or whatever, and are unable to protect the real worlds. And somehow Maleficent and Pete know about this. They also somehow knew that nobody strong was at Disney castle. However, they did not act on this very well.

What do they do? The two kidnap a completely unguarded Minnie, in an unguarded Disney castle (well not totally unguarded, but all that were there were just KH's version of red coats), and just wait there for Mickey, Donald, and Goofy to come back......What the heck?

They needed Mickey, Donald and Goofy to come back in order to demand the Data worlds. They were going to give Minnie back, they just were using her for the data worlds.

Okay, please correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't Maleficent have some control over the Heartless? And Pete too, through her. So why didn't they bring a whole army of Heartless, or at least a few really big ones, and lay siege to the castle? And technically Maleficent has like a whole army of little goblin thingies, but I don't think they ever showed up in the games.

Because they knew they could have done it. And if it weren't for Lea showing up, I think Maleficent and Pete would have suceeded.

And for that matter, where were all of the other Disney villains? Surely Maleficent still had ties with them. Yeah Ursula showed her ugly face up but failed miserably.

Remember, Ursula did say "Oh, he was right. Those wretched guppies are here."
It was a phantom Ursula who was brought to attack Sora and Riku. It might have been a part of the test Yen Sid gave them, or Xehanort could have brought her with him.

I mean really, this is just so stupid. They just wanted this game to be all about dumb ol' Xehnahort (again), and only him (again) that they forgot a big chunk of the Disney aspect of this. I mean the Disney villains are not stupid, or weak, give them some credit.

Trust me, Disney villains should be a part of something big in the next large game.

And on a slightly different note, what's stopping all the Disney villains from trying to get the Princesses of Heart again? If they know Sora and Riku cannot get in their way, then they should know it would be pretty easy to capture the Princesses.

They failed. It took them like 9 years to do that.
They don't have the time, nor the patience to do it all again.

 

[Swordsy]

Considering the villains the Princesses of Heart were being kidnapped by are already gone, they won't be coming to take them.

Okay, I suppose that is true, but there are other Disney villains that are still hanging around, and I don't see why they couldn't be recruited by someone to get the Princesses. There's Hook and Hades. Plus there are some that have yet to show, but will most likely, and in fact I think are the ones to be filling this role in KH3. They are Gaston, Chernabog (or is he dead? Because first he appeared in the realm of darkness I think, but I don't think that was the real him.), any of Pinnochio's villains because now that world is wide awake and none of them are dead (Monstro is around, but I think Stromboli, the Coachman, or the cat and fox dudes, whatever their names were are more likely to do this). Those are just a few, but there could be more.

Well, I really need to refresh my memory here: which Disney villains from the past games do we know for sure are dead? Ursula, Scar, and who else?

 

[Chaser]

Okay, I suppose that is true, but there are other Disney villains that are still hanging around, and I don't see why they couldn't be recruited by someone to get the Princesses. There's Hook and Hades. Plus there are some that have yet to show, but will most likely, and in fact I think are the ones to be filling this role in KH3. They are Gaston, Chernabog (or is he dead? Because first he appeared in the realm of darkness I think, but I don't think that was the real him.), any of Pinnochio's villains because now that world is wide awake and none of them are dead (Monstro is around, but I think Stromboli, the Coachman, or the cat and fox dudes, whatever their names were are more likely to do this). Those are just a few, but there could be more.

Sora and Riku were in the Realm of Sleep. They weren't going to focus on anything outside of the immediate story.
The Princesses are coming back, okay. And Maleficent is talking more about them now, so you might be able to expect a villain or two going after them, but the majority of villains going after the PoH would be one of the 13.

Well, I really need to refresh my memory here: which Disney villains from the past games do we know for sure are dead? Ursula, Scar, and who else?

Oogie Boogie. But they can all be revived, seeing as Oogie and Ursula were both revived, which means it doesn't really matter.
What depends on a villain showing up is if the world is being used, and if the storyline would require the villain to be in it.

 

[rac7d]

Well thie first time it took a while to get organize and find out who all the princess were and located. If maleficent tried again she should be able to she know where all the worlds are and the princess would be defenseless again

 

[BagelBreath]

I'd like to see the plot of TLM2 in KH3 if we have to visit Atlantica again. Instead of Ursala, we could have Ursula's skinny sister kidnap Melody and lure Ariel, like the movie.
They've already said that time flows differently in different worlds, so I don't see how it could be a problem. It's better than re-living the plot of the first movie... again. =/
Cinderella's world could make a comeback. There's a 3rd Cinderella movie where the stepmom gets the fairy godmother's wand. I didn't watch all of it, so I don't know how it work.

 

[Memory Master]

Okay first thing is first: This is the Xehanort Saga after all so most of the attention directed toward villains will be at Xehanort, especially considering we are nearing the end of his saga.

Next, Maleficent has been manipulated by Xehanort through out the series. MX told her about the Princesses of Heart so she would go after them, XH oversaw her kidnapping of the princesses, and Xemnas had some role to play in helping her return from the realm of darkness in KH2 because he believed her return would cause more heartless to appear which would help in completing the artificial KH. So even alot of her actions are tied to Xehanort's plan.

On the issue of Ursula. The Ursula is KH3D is not the real Ursula. The KH3D strategy guide calls her "Phantom Ursula" which means she is an illusion. The real Ursula is dead.

On the issue of the Disney villains who have sided with Maleficent in the past. Alot of them are dead now. I know people think they can be revived but in truth they can't. See most of the villains tied to Maleficent didn't actually die in KH1, so when they came back in KH2 it was not by resurrection.

1. Oogie Boogie: In KH1 we clearly see his brain bug survived. As long as the brain bug survives then Oogie is not dead. Maleficent simply used her magic in KH2 to rebuild him, not bring him back to life. After he is defeated in KH2 we see Donald crush his brain bug which means now he is really dead.

2. Maleficent: Alot of people think Maleficent died in KH1. The truth is she somehow ended up in the realm of darkness. Vexen says so in COM. When Zexion says he sensed Maleficent in the caslte, Vexen replies "Impossible, the witch is gone. She cannot return from the realm of darkness of her own volition." and then of course Zexion explains what he sensed was actually the memory version of her. In KH2 Maleficent used her ties to the 3 good fairies to return from the realm of darkness, just as Sora used his ties to Kairi to return from the realm inbetween at the end of KH2.

3. Jafar: Was stuck in a lamp in KH1 but in KH2 his lamp was destroyed which means he is dead now too.

4. Ursula: This is the only one that has not been explained. She just shows up again in KH2 out of nowhere. Though I heard someone say one time perhaps after her defeat in KH1 she turned into one of those little plant things she turns people into and Maleficent came along and turned her back to normal in KH2 or something. But whatever the case I think we can assume Ursula is really dead now.

So the only villains who were part of Maleficent's council in KH1 that are still alive are Captain Hook and Hades.

Now why didn't Maleficent storm the castle with an army of heartless? (BTW, let me just point out that Maleficent was able to by pass the conerstone of light in KH3D because the balance of light and darkness in the universe has shifted so far to darkness due to MX's return, which has severly weakened the effects of the cornerstone of light). Maleficent came to Disney Caslte to get the "Data" of worlds. Why attack a castle with an army and risk damaging the very thing you came there to get. It's much smarter to use Queen Mickey as a bargaining chip to get the data. Once she had the data then she should have attacked the castle with heartless. Since Lea intervened though she has to wait for another chance to get the data.

So I really don't see what you're complaining about here.

EDIT: Oh and on the issue of time flowing differently in each world. I'm pretty sure the term "world" is refering to the different realms in the KH universe. Time flows one way in the realm of light, Time doesn't flow at all or very very slowly in the realm of darkness, time flow differently in the realm of sleep. And in the case of the different flow of time in Sora's side and Riku's side in KH3, remember Riku was inside of Sora's dreams while Sora was actually in the dreams of the sleeping worlds.

I think it's pretty obvious that time does not flow differently for each individual world in a realm. (Besides the realm of sleep but that's due to Sora and Riku's situation). Time for all the worlds in the realm of light i'm pretty sure flows the same. There has been nothing suggesting time has ever flowed differently for each individual world in the realm of light. Plus remeber all those worlds used to be one massive world, so it would make since that all the worlds in the realm of light have the same flow of time.

 

[Sinxeckt]

I don't think we'll see that kind of scenario shown in KH1 again, with the Disney villains uniting for a single purpose. As said before, the plan took almost a decade, so it's not worth it to try again. If that's what you're looking for from the Disney villains for the rest of the series (or saga) you might be disappointed. I say 'might be' because I'm hoping KHIII will introduce many more brand new Disney worlds, which means more respective villains. You never know what Xehanort has up his sleeve.

 

[kupo1121]

Ursula is sorta...not in the RoL anymore considering she took a harpoon to the chest

lol, it sounds so casual "she sorta...took a harpoon to the chest" lmao xP

I'd like to see the plot of TLM2 in KH3 if we have to visit Atlantica again. Instead of Ursala, we could have Ursula's skinny sister kidnap Melody and lure Ariel, like the movie.
Cinderella's world could make a comeback. There's a 3rd Cinderella movie where the stepmom gets the fairy godmother's wand. I didn't watch all of it, so I don't know how it work.

I'd rather Morgana (Ursala's sister) not sure Melody as a bargaining chip. She has so much power on her own, I'd rather see the ice pillar she creates at the end of TLM2 as a great platforming section perhaps. I mean, why would she want Ariel and thus use Melody as a bargaining chip considering Ariel isn't a PoH? If anything, she'd want the trident or possibly try to bring Ursala back if that is possible. Also, there always is a sequel to Lion King and the threequel to Aladdin, not to mention a Mulan sequel, Peter Pan sequel, and many other sequels (most of which weren't that good) to use along with hopefully some Pixar movies. But I digress, this isn't the future worlds thread.

Alot of them are dead now. I know people think they can be revived but in truth they can't. See most of the villains tied to Maleficent didn't actually die in KH1, so when they came back in KH2 it was not by resurrection.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Nomura say that there was no death in Kingdom Hearts, in which case it would be possible to bring them all back. Also, Maleficent cast a spell on herself that so long as people remembered her she could return. I don't think the Org. knew that which is why Vexen was shocked to hear Zexion pick up her scent and is also why the three fairies started getting worried when they started to remember her, because they knew if they did, she would return.

 

[Swordsy]

Why attack a castle with an army and risk damaging the very thing you came there to get. It's much smarter to use Queen Mickey as a bargaining chip to get the data. Once she had the data then she should have attacked the castle with heartless. Since Lea intervened though she has to wait for another chance to get the data.

I said that Maleficent and Pete should have laid siege to the castle with their Heartless or any other minions. That's why I'm complaining, because they could have stopped Mickey and the others from coming back at the castle gate while the entire place is overrun with their forces. Then they would've had no problem obtaining the data. But no, instead they just stupidly walk right into the place completely by themselves with absolutley no backup or backup plan.

 

[Sephiroth0812]

You are the one who doesn't understand. Malefcient would not gain anything by stopping Mickey because she wants him to come back because only he can give her access to the Datascape.

Furthermore, Heartless only obey the strongest dark fella around and that is Xehanort. Maleficent lost control over the Heartless way back in KH2, she has no more Heartless to command.

 

[KyleSnyder]

Furthermore, Heartless only obey the strongest dark fella around and that is Xehanort. Maleficent lost control over the Heartless way back in KH2, she has no more Heartless to command.

Then how do you explain how she was able to summon heartless in Re: Coded after she destroyed Data Sora's first keyblade? I think she managed to regain control of some heartless after KH2.

 

[Chaser]

Then how do you explain how she was able to summon heartless in Re: Coded after she destroyed Data Sora's first keyblade? I think she managed to regain control of some heartless after KH2.

They were Data Heartless. From when she could control them.

 

[Sephiroth0812]

Then how do you explain how she was able to summon heartless in Re: Coded after she destroyed Data Sora's first keyblade? I think she managed to regain control of some heartless after KH2.

Hah, I was expecting that question, lol.
It's totally simple:
The Heartless in Re: Coded are inside the Journal (aka the Datascape).
That's the whole point of Maleficent's plan in Re: Coded: She wants to use the data worlds (which are from the time of KH 1) to build up a new Heartless army and eventually bring it over to the real world in order to gain back her power base.

The Heartless Maleficent commands in Re: Coded are digital ones inside the Datascape and the only reason she can command them is because there is no Data-Ansem, Seeker of Darkness around in Re: Coded.

 

[Original Sin]

Also: Cornerstone of Light? Doesn't it protect the Castle from Heartless anyway?

 

[kupo1121]

Also: Cornerstone of Light? Doesn't it protect the Castle from Heartless anyway?

The Cornerstone does protect Disney Castle from darkness so yes, you are correct, that as well.

P.S. Did anyone else find it really funny when Maleficent, the Mistress of All Evil and her big, bad henchman failed to hold a small queen mouse hostage when the Minnie used Faith lol xP It was like when Xaldin lost to Belle's elbow of doom in KH2 lmao xP

 

[Mirby]

Okay first thing is first: This is the Xehanort Saga after all so most of the attention directed toward villains will be at Xehanort, especially considering we are nearing the end of his saga.

Next, Maleficent has been manipulated by Xehanort through out the series. MX told her about the Princesses of Heart so she would go after them, XH oversaw her kidnapping of the princesses, and Xemnas had some role to play in helping her return from the realm of darkness in KH2 because he believed her return would cause more heartless to appear which would help in completing the artificial KH. So even alot of her actions are tied to Xehanort's plan.

On the issue of Ursula. The Ursula is KH3D is not the real Ursula. The KH3D strategy guide calls her "Phantom Ursula" which means she is an illusion. The real Ursula is dead.

On the issue of the Disney villains who have sided with Maleficent in the past. Alot of them are dead now. I know people think they can be revived but in truth they can't. See most of the villains tied to Maleficent didn't actually die in KH1, so when they came back in KH2 it was not by resurrection.

1. Oogie Boogie: In KH1 we clearly see his brain bug survived. As long as the brain bug survives then Oogie is not dead. Maleficent simply used her magic in KH2 to rebuild him, not bring him back to life. After he is defeated in KH2 we see Donald crush his brain bug which means now he is really dead.

2. Maleficent: Alot of people think Maleficent died in KH1. The truth is she somehow ended up in the realm of darkness. Vexen says so in COM. When Zexion says he sensed Maleficent in the caslte, Vexen replies "Impossible, the witch is gone. She cannot return from the realm of darkness of her own volition." and then of course Zexion explains what he sensed was actually the memory version of her. In KH2 Maleficent used her ties to the 3 good fairies to return from the realm of darkness, just as Sora used his ties to Kairi to return from the realm inbetween at the end of KH2.

3. Jafar: Was stuck in a lamp in KH1 but in KH2 his lamp was destroyed which means he is dead now too.

4. Ursula: This is the only one that has not been explained. She just shows up again in KH2 out of nowhere. Though I heard someone say one time perhaps after her defeat in KH1 she turned into one of those little plant things she turns people into and Maleficent came along and turned her back to normal in KH2 or something. But whatever the case I think we can assume Ursula is really dead now.

So the only villains who were part of Maleficent's council in KH1 that are still alive are Captain Hook and Hades.

Now why didn't Maleficent storm the castle with an army of heartless? (BTW, let me just point out that Maleficent was able to by pass the conerstone of light in KH3D because the balance of light and darkness in the universe has shifted so far to darkness due to MX's return, which has severly weakened the effects of the cornerstone of light). Maleficent came to Disney Caslte to get the "Data" of worlds. Why attack a castle with an army and risk damaging the very thing you came there to get. It's much smarter to use Queen Mickey as a bargaining chip to get the data. Once she had the data then she should have attacked the castle with heartless. Since Lea intervened though she has to wait for another chance to get the data.

So I really don't see what you're complaining about here.

EDIT: Oh and on the issue of time flowing differently in each world. I'm pretty sure the term "world" is refering to the different realms in the KH universe. Time flows one way in the realm of light, Time doesn't flow at all or very very slowly in the realm of darkness, time flow differently in the realm of sleep. And in the case of the different flow of time in Sora's side and Riku's side in KH3, remember Riku was inside of Sora's dreams while Sora was actually in the dreams of the sleeping worlds.

I think it's pretty obvious that time does not flow differently for each individual world in a realm. (Besides the realm of sleep but that's due to Sora and Riku's situation). Time for all the worlds in the realm of light i'm pretty sure flows the same. There has been nothing suggesting time has ever flowed differently for each individual world in the realm of light. Plus remeber all those worlds used to be one massive world, so it would make since that all the worlds in the realm of light have the same flow of time.

I just want to add that though Hades may not be dead (he is a god after all), he's probably severely weakened after his dive into the river of souls.

 

[BagelBreath]

I'd rather Morgana (Ursala's sister) not sure Melody as a bargaining chip. She has so much power on her own, I'd rather see the ice pillar she creates at the end of TLM2 as a great platforming section perhaps. I mean, why would she want Ariel and thus use Melody as a bargaining chip considering Ariel isn't a PoH? If anything, she'd want the trident or possibly try to bring Ursala back if that is possible. Also, there always is a sequel to Lion King and the threequel to Aladdin, not to mention a Mulan sequel, Peter Pan sequel, and many other sequels (most of which weren't that good) to use along with hopefully some Pixar movies. But I digress, this isn't the future worlds thread.

I derped and forgot that Ariel isn't a PoH. xD
Wasn't the movie about luring Ariel though? I thought they wanted to kill her or something.
IDK, I saw it a long time ago. ;x

 

[Marx15]

Okay, please correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't Maleficent have some control over the Heartless? And Pete too, through her. So why didn't they bring a whole army of Heartless, or at least a few really big ones, and lay siege to the castle? And technically Maleficent has like a whole army of little goblin thingies, but I don't think they ever showed up in the games.

And for that matter, where were all of the other Disney villains? Surely Maleficent still had ties with them. Yeah Ursula showed her ugly face up but failed miserably.

I mean really, this is just so stupid. They just wanted this game to be all about dumb ol' Xehnahort (again), and only him (again) that they forgot a big chunk of the Disney aspect of this. I mean the Disney villains are not stupid, or weak, give them some credit.

For not attacking the castle.....that wasn't their plan in the slightest, so why would they?
Only Mickey knows how to access the Data World, so Maleficent wanted him to give it to her, since she obviously doesn't know how to get back into it.

Also, there is the cornerstone of light within Disney Castle, and it's working fine. It keeps darkness out, that's what has protected the world from Heartless all these years.

All the other Disney villains are either Dead, Haven't Been Brought Into The Story (HBBItS), Don't Have An Impact To The Rest Of The Story At This Time (DHaIttRotSaTT)

Yes, this game focused way more on Xehanort than any other. Even though BBS was a game about Xehanort's Past, this game focuses even more.

They had the exact amount of Villains for each Disney World within the game.

I derped and forgot that Ariel isn't a PoH. xD
Wasn't the movie about luring Ariel though? I thought they wanted to kill her or something.
IDK, I saw it a long time ago. ;x

TLM 1's plot....was the same for Atlantica in KH2.

TLM 2's plot is that Ariel lives on land with her family, and her daughter feels out of place or something, and she turns into a mermaid (Ursula I think....) and she can't really change back. I don't remember the entire plot for the second one....