Wouldnt it be awesome if Roxas and Ven meet? like if sora actually saved both of them and they end up meeting. Or if Ven fights Sora. idk im just shootin stuff out there
Ven/Roxas
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There is a possibility for that actually.
It depends if Roxas can become his own independent person or not.
As of now we don't know what saving Roxas means in detail. We only know that he needs to be saved, that he wants to remember Xion, meet Axel/Lea again and that he desires to be his own existence.
So yeah, there is a possibility for such a meeting, that's for sure.
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As for Ven fighting Sora I don't see why they would fight each other except in a sparring match. Considering they both have very kind personalities and Ven surely won't attack the guy who saved his heart twice, I can't really see them fighting each other willingly...only exception maybe that Sora gets mistaken for Vanitas, lol.
It depends if Roxas can become his own independent person or not.
As of now we don't know what saving Roxas means in detail. We only know that he needs to be saved, that he wants to remember Xion, meet Axel/Lea again and that he desires to be his own existence.
So yeah, there is a possibility for such a meeting, that's for sure.
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As for Ven fighting Sora I don't see why they would fight each other except in a sparring match. Considering they both have very kind personalities and Ven surely won't attack the guy who saved his heart twice, I can't really see them fighting each other willingly...only exception maybe that Sora gets mistaken for Vanitas, lol.
We know the gist.
Memories of Xion and his Summer Vacation.
Which then leads to Roxas becoming his own self, and Data TT and Data inside Sora [lightbulb turns on], blah blah blah...
Wouldn't having Ven back mean Roxas is out of the equation? I mean the only reason Roxas looks how he does is because of Ven's heart. So if that's put back in it's original spot Roxas would look different right? Same memories but different more or less.
Agreed, we know the core of his torment and what he wants, yet the way how this is all solved is still uncertain.
You made a interesting proposal though...using the Data TT as an intermediary sounds quite intriguing.
The data inside Sora is supposed to hold all results on Ansem's second great research spree on the heart, memories and emotions while he was DiZ.
That may be the key to put back a probably scattered heart (Terra), heal an injured one (Ven) and how to "create" a new heart, which would then be the core-information needed for Roxas, Xion and also Naminé.
EDIT:
@Xenin:
Nope, Roxas looked like that because of Ven's heart while he was independent. His appearance now (inside Sora) is how he and all who know him remember it.
Take a look at when Roxas projects himself from Sora in KH 2 when he speaks with Naminé, they have their forms how they remember them now.
Ven's heart was by then already back in Sora's.
Also, if Data TT was in Sora, both Roxas and Xion could inhabit it and be their own selves, all the while never taking anything away from Sora.
But the Data TT isn't inside Sora, the Data TT is in a computer that was connected to Sora's sleeping pod.
For Roxas and Xion to become their own independent existences only their own memories (whose also hold their appearances) would be needed to put into a new heart.
They already gave back everything they "borrowed" from Sora, but their own memories, which define them as "independent" from Sora in terms of thoughts and mind are also within Sora because they have no container where they can be stored.
how would one create a heart? i personally wanna kno how xion would be saved. she is after all only fragments of sora's memory. so if question for her to come into existence again...part of sora's memory goes with her? and who is to say after Ven is saved or however he is saved from his "torment" that Sora is still able to use the keyblade? yes he might have a strong enough heart to continue to use one but thats just a loose thought. and ya i could see Ven fighting Sora based on how he looks like Vanitas. he could say "hey Terra, Aqua...thats vanitas!!" fight begins. something like that, and also on that point if Ven comes back with his heart fully intact. shouldnt by some extension Vanitas comes back? not fully a human. but since he is the darkness of Ven's heart. and Their hearts are together again, Vanitas is still inside Ven. Or he could be just some darkness now with no form or name at all. ya kno?
For the first, we don't know how or if it's possible. There were however questions rised in Coded-interviews if Data existences are able to "develop" hearts.
And the main goal of Ansem's apprentices and Apprentice Xehanort was to someday create hearts out of nothing.
No, Xion's former independent existence we saw in Days was formed from Sora's memories, yes, but while Xion was independent she created memories of her own, memories which belong only to her and are the core of her own "self".
Roxas is the same, his body and soul borrowed from Sora, the emotions sapped from another injured heart he unknowingly carried around, all that he had to give back. His own memories are what still define him and allow him to live on in Sora.
Why would Sora not be able to use the keyblade when Ven is saved? Sora has his own keyblade which was orignally Riku's, but it choose Sora over Riku for good in Hollow Bastion in KH 1.
The only thing Sora may perhaps loose is the dual-wield abiliity, as the second keyblade is Ven's.
Sora didn't inherit anything from Ven, that was made clear several times.
We don't know what Vanitas's exact fate is...he may have been re-absorbed by Ven but that's not confirmed. He could also be destroyed for good (and then also his dark heart, which is a shard of Ven's heart, would be gone) or his dark heart was as injured as Ven's was when the x-blade was destroyed and he's out there somewhere.
And the main goal of Ansem's apprentices and Apprentice Xehanort was to someday create hearts out of nothing.
No, Xion's former independent existence we saw in Days was formed from Sora's memories, yes, but while Xion was independent she created memories of her own, memories which belong only to her and are the core of her own "self".
Roxas is the same, his body and soul borrowed from Sora, the emotions sapped from another injured heart he unknowingly carried around, all that he had to give back. His own memories are what still define him and allow him to live on in Sora.
Why would Sora not be able to use the keyblade when Ven is saved? Sora has his own keyblade which was orignally Riku's, but it choose Sora over Riku for good in Hollow Bastion in KH 1.
The only thing Sora may perhaps loose is the dual-wield abiliity, as the second keyblade is Ven's.
Sora didn't inherit anything from Ven, that was made clear several times.
We don't know what Vanitas's exact fate is...he may have been re-absorbed by Ven but that's not confirmed. He could also be destroyed for good (and then also his dark heart, which is a shard of Ven's heart, would be gone) or his dark heart was as injured as Ven's was when the x-blade was destroyed and he's out there somewhere.
true i just looked back into BBS and i correct myself with the whole ven sora thing. i apologize.
Xion and roxas yes they were created from borrowed memories (xion) and a borrowed body and heart (sroa and ven) yes they have thier own memories to define them. but do memories create hearts? is their existence truly based on their memories? and for tht matter like a nobody do they truly exist if only they have their memories to define them. idk if memories can create a brand new heart. we'll see what nomura is up to.
and as of Vanitas i have to agree with u there, for all we know he could end up inside riku...highly unlikely. but ya know lol
Xion and roxas yes they were created from borrowed memories (xion) and a borrowed body and heart (sroa and ven) yes they have thier own memories to define them. but do memories create hearts? is their existence truly based on their memories? and for tht matter like a nobody do they truly exist if only they have their memories to define them. idk if memories can create a brand new heart. we'll see what nomura is up to.
and as of Vanitas i have to agree with u there, for all we know he could end up inside riku...highly unlikely. but ya know lol
No need to apologize, everyone can mix something up. 
Heck, about the dual-wielding Nomura may even go the way to say: "Yes, Sora sheltered Ven's heart to ease it's pain and has to give it back when it's healed, so he'll loose the second keyblade, but there's a catch."
As we know, Sora and Roxas were able to use the same keyblade in two different places at once...if it's necessary for "coolness" or gameplay reasons Nomura may go and declare that because the connection between their hearts is so strong (the one formed at the beginning of BBS when Sora's newborn heart healed Ven's first injury) both Sora and Ven can dual wield each others keyblades in the future.
As for Roxas, Naminé and Xion I would say yes, as their own memories, which they created while independent, are the only things that are truly their own. All other "parts" of their existences were borrowed and had to be given back, that's why they had no choice.
But going out from the viewpoint that memories are truly powerful and very important I bet Nomura is up to something there.
With Nomura everything is possible, even a return of Vanitas.
Heck, about the dual-wielding Nomura may even go the way to say: "Yes, Sora sheltered Ven's heart to ease it's pain and has to give it back when it's healed, so he'll loose the second keyblade, but there's a catch."
As we know, Sora and Roxas were able to use the same keyblade in two different places at once...if it's necessary for "coolness" or gameplay reasons Nomura may go and declare that because the connection between their hearts is so strong (the one formed at the beginning of BBS when Sora's newborn heart healed Ven's first injury) both Sora and Ven can dual wield each others keyblades in the future.
This is actually a core question, or rather, the core question is how is a new heart formed. We know for sure from KH: CoM that memories are a crucial part of a heart. Memories seem to be exceptionally powerful in the KH Universe as it was said also that Memories are practically "immortal" as they can be lost or forgotten but never truly fade.
As for Roxas, Naminé and Xion I would say yes, as their own memories, which they created while independent, are the only things that are truly their own. All other "parts" of their existences were borrowed and had to be given back, that's why they had no choice.
But going out from the viewpoint that memories are truly powerful and very important I bet Nomura is up to something there.
With Nomura everything is possible, even a return of Vanitas.
The day before Roxas merged with Sora completely, DiZ wrote another report. In it, he expresses (some) sorrow toward Roxas and Namine. Maybe he put a copy of the data TT inside Sora at that time, using that to try and make up what he did to Roxas.
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In the end both Ven and Roxas will have to be saved, but the whole Ven/Sora/Roxas part where someone has someone's heart and someone has someone's keyblade is sort of complicated and I still have trouble wrapping my head around it. Having Roxas, Xion, and Namine return at all is a problem in itself. I wonder how Nomura will have them come back. Would they find some way to get their own hearts and bodies? All that's really left of them is their memories. Bringing Xion back sounds especially complicated since no one remembers her, and her memory must be deep inside Sora.
And having Roxas and Ven meeting and working together with all the other protaganists in future games might be a problem. Even if they have different clothes and keyblades, the player could still get confused.
And having Roxas and Ven meeting and working together with all the other protaganists in future games might be a problem. Even if they have different clothes and keyblades, the player could still get confused.
Could you detail which report that was? I only know that DiZ was regretful towards Riku in the Secret Ansem Report 13, and that he realized only later that Roxas was his own person, as well as Naminé when he was travelling to the world that never was.luap911 said:
That's the reason for his apology before his machine overloads.
I won't rule out the possibility of the Data TT, may it be a permament Solution for Roxas (and maybe Xion) or just a transitional stage for them to finally become their own independent persons.
Remember there's still also the problem of wanting to be reunited again with Axel/Lea, and with Nomura saying the "Thank you" between the Data versions of Sora and Naminé doesn't "really count" I dunno about having a Data Axel would be sufficient enough.
However, in Blank Points Ansem the Wise expresses true regret for all the lives he directly or indirectly ruined to Aqua and says he hopes that Sora can use the results of his research to give everyone "a second chance". I think it's not that far-fetched to believe that Roxas and Naminé were included in that "everyone".
Crystal said:
In essence, they are a form of twins, just not blood-related. If one want's to be nitpicky, we could even say they form a triplet with Sora.
Of course then they will have their own memories for themselves, that's actually a prerequisite, not a result.
Roxas having still a keyblade depends. Nomura once said that one requirement for wielding a keyblade is to have a memory of holding one, which Roxas clearly does, as seen in KH 2 when he challenges Sora, he has both his oathkeeper and oblivion keyblades formed from his memories.
So, when Roxas really gains/creates an own heart where his memories can be stored in it depends if that new heart is qualified to be choosen by a keyblade. The odds for this are obviously there as Roxas already has the memories of wielding.
Maxyli138 said:
It's actually not really that complicated (at least compared to the Terra/Eraqus/Xehanort mess).
For the someone has someone's heart it's just as follows:
1. Ven's injured heart rests inside Sora's to lessen its pain. Sora allowed it in the end of BBS.
2. When Sora's heart succumbed to its own darkness, becoming a heartless, Ven's heart was "kicked out" of Sora's and because it's injured and largely inactive it remained stuck inside Sora's body.
3. Ven's heart re-shaped Sora's body to look like Ven because it was the only heart left within the body.
4. Roxas used Sora's body for a year, but because he had no memories of Sora and co-existed with him (thanks to Kairi's interference restoring Sora) he developed an own existence, all the while sapping emotions from Ven's injured heart he unknowingly carried.
5. When rejoining with Sora, Roxas brought Ven's heart back with him, giving back all that he had "borrowed" from others. Still, his own memories, which also include the memory of his own appearance, remain to define him.
As for the keyblades:
Sora can us his own and Ven's in dual wielding, while Ven has his own.
Roxas uses both Sora's and Ven's keyblades while independent, so when he becomes independent for good he has the memory of wielding keyblades, but may actually need to get his own keyblade before he can wield again.
There is a problem, yes, because they have a mind and thoughts and see themselves as own persons, yet lack any part of an own existence. To solve this problem may be one of the tasks that are to be adressed in either KH 3D or KH III.
Finding someway to get them own hearts and bodies is a possibility, yes.
About "All that's left of them are memories" I would be careful, memories are shown to be one of the most powerful things in the KH Universe, a crucial part of a heart and can never truly fade.
Yeah, Xion's case may be more complicated but that doesn't mean it's impossible. Terra's case may also be more complicated than Aqua's or Ven's.
Now I really don't see what the problem is. If one gets confused it's the problem of the player, not the series. For example in Neon Genesis Evangelion we also have multiple Rei Ayanamis, they even come together n some scenes, so what?
It's actually funny, as from 5th to 10th grade I had a pair of identical twins in my class...and they liked to sometimes even put on the same clothes.
While most of the teachers and all of our classmates could easily tell them apart there where only a few teachers who couldn't.
But gosh, for all I care, if it comes to that scenario they could just give Roxas when he becomes independent some bits more Sora-influence and turn his hair color a darker blonde than Ven's just for the sake of differentiating.
Roxas can wield because Sora can, yes, and their second keyblade is from Ven.
So technically Roxas may lose his wielding ability temporary when going completely independent.
However, he has memories of wielding a keyblade and that is said to be a requirement to obtain a keyblade beside a strong heart.
Furthermore I think it's highly likely that Roxas, while no more dependent on Sora, still stays connected to Sora.
So the possibility for him to re-gain the keyblade/being chosen by a new one just for him is there.
So technically Roxas may lose his wielding ability temporary when going completely independent.
However, he has memories of wielding a keyblade and that is said to be a requirement to obtain a keyblade beside a strong heart.
Furthermore I think it's highly likely that Roxas, while no more dependent on Sora, still stays connected to Sora.
So the possibility for him to re-gain the keyblade/being chosen by a new one just for him is there.
I think it would be a lot more poignant if Ven obtained Roxas' memories, rather than the two having separate existences.
With the probable return of Lea, we'll also have someone with Axel's memories.
Then it would come full circle. Ven and Lea would be friends, like they had been years back, but Axel and Roxas' friendship would live on through them as well.
Sorry, but the idea of Ven and Roxas having their own separate existences at the same time seems ludicrous to me.
With the probable return of Lea, we'll also have someone with Axel's memories.
Then it would come full circle. Ven and Lea would be friends, like they had been years back, but Axel and Roxas' friendship would live on through them as well.
Sorry, but the idea of Ven and Roxas having their own separate existences at the same time seems ludicrous to me.
Yeah. I'd have to agree with Grass' opinion on this.
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this is what should happen. Roxas and Ven shouldn't co-exist.
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